http://www.heraldbiz.com/SITE/data/img_dir/2006/01/18/200601180035.jpg
http://www.heraldbiz.com/SITE/data/img_dir/2006/01/18/200601180036.jpg

Since the underpin didn't change from older Magnus, it shouldn't be too hard for Chery to clone.

Here are the first generation Daewoo Magnus/Chevy Epica(In Canada and China) pics.

http://www.canadiandriver.com/articles/gw/images/03optra_1.jpg

http://www.canadianautoreview.com/epica-rearside1-800.JPG

http://www.canadianautoreview.com/epica-frontside3-800.JPG

http://www.canadianautoreview.com/epica-dash-800.JPG

Son of Orient cannot be sold in the US due to intellectual property issues(it is an unauthorized mechanical duplication of Daewoo Magnus sold as Suzuki Verona and Chevy Epica)

This is a problem for a large segment of chinese cars... blatent ripoffism..

Chery Eastar does not even look like Chevy Epica - Daewoo Magnus. Chery introduced new Eastar before Daewoo come out with Magnus. How can they copy their car even before their car is released?

Chery Eastar does not even look like Chevy Epica - Daewoo Magnus.
Styling change is relatively easy; Magnus, Epica, Verona, and Tosca look different from each other. what matters is what is underneath the skin.

Chery introduced new Eastar before Daewoo come out with Magnus. How can they copy their car even before their car is released?
Magnus came out in 1999. The reskinned model came out in 2006.

http://www.autoreview.ru/new_site/year2004/n15/puzzle/800/06.jpg
http://dimg.163.com/auto/2004/gallery/Chery/DFZZ/002.jpg


http://www.vnn.vn/dataimages/original/images105793_Magnus01.jpg
http://dimg.163.com/auto/2004/gallery/Chery/DFZZ/001.jpg

http://www.newyorker.com/printables/fact/050926fa_fact2

In June of 2003, half a year before the Spark went on the market, Chery unveiled the QQ. It looked almost exactly like G.M.’s car but retailed for a quarter less: about six thousand dollars. Chery also introduced a sedan that appeared suspiciously similar to the Daewoo Magnus. Chery named that car the Son of the Orient.

It is a public knowledge that the Son of Orient is an illegal replica of Daewoo Magnus, recreated by ex-Daewoo engineers who took the design drawings with them during Daewoo'd banktruptcy proceeding.

If Eastar is a copy of Magnus, why didn't GM sue Chery like they did to QQ when they accuse QQ of being a copy of Spark.

The interior of Chery Eastar does not look anything like Daewoo Chevy Magnus

http://www.mychery.net/forum/html/ut/attach/2006/03/08/5856182-dfzz-embed.jpg

http://autoworld.agava.ru/img/fotoint/daewmi.jpg
http://auto.tom.com/img/assets/200306/dfzz06137.jpg

Any question as to why Chery's "flagship" cannot make it outside of China???

This is why Japanese and Korean automakers don't take Chery seriously; they are nothing but a bunch of auto pirates.

Any question as to why Chery's "flagship" cannot make it outside of China???

This is why Japanese and Korean automakers don't take Chery seriously; they are nothing but a bunch of auto pirates.

The Chery Eastar/Oriental Sun has been sold in many middle eastern and eastern european countries.

here is pic of people in Russian driving Chery Oriental Sun

http://image.xcar.com.cn/attachments/day_060217/BaCy_china_4.jpg

The Chery Eastar/Oriental Sun has been sold in many middle eastern and eastern european countries.
Yap, the places where there is no respect for other people's IPs. Which does not include the US and EU markets.

Yap, the places where there is no respect for other people's IPs. Which does not include the US and EU markets.

When Chery starts selling in developed markets, they can sell the Eastar because GM has no complaints about it.

When Chery starts selling in developed markets, they can sell the Eastar because GM has no complaints about it.
God, you honestly believe GM lawyers are going to let this slip in the US and EU market??? Selling the Son Of Orient is considered a crime in the US and EU.

Even you can see how Chery ripped off an old Daewoo design presently owned by GM, can't you?

http://www.newyorker.com/printables/fact/050926fa_fact2



It is a public knowledge that the Son of Orient is an illegal replica of Daewoo Magnus, recreated by ex-Daewoo engineers who took the design drawings with them during Daewoo'd banktruptcy proceeding.

so the daewoo engineers took the blueprints for the Daewoo Matiz and Daewoo Magnus and gave them or sold them to Chery?

so the daewoo engineers took the blueprints for the Daewoo Matiz and Daewoo Magnus and gave them or sold them to Chery?
They work for Chery now.

They work for Chery now.

Did GM fire them. If the Daewoo engineers work for Chery and designed their cars then it's not copying.

Did GM fire them.
No, Chery lured them away with promises of a big payoff if they would come to Chery with stolen design files.

If the Daewoo engineers work for Chery and designed their cars then it's not copying.
Of course. But they didn't design QQ and Son Of Orient; they simply recreated them using the files they brought from Daewoo.

Employees moving between employer is fine. As long as no intellectual property is taken from the old job.

No, Chery lured them away with promises of a big payoff if they would come to Chery with stolen design files.


Of course. But they didn't design QQ and Son Of Orient; they simply recreated them using the files they brought from Daewoo.

Employees moving between employer is fine. As long as no intellectual property is taken from the old job.

What the Daewoo engineers did is not illegal. They were the ones who created the blueprints so they own the blueprints. If they want to work for Chery then it's their choice.

What the Daewoo engineers did is not illegal. They were the ones who created the blueprints so they own the blueprints. If they want to work for Chery then it's their choice.
OK.... Now I see the laws are different in China and why Chinese don't understand western companies are going crazy over "transfer" of design drawings....

Kinda funny, because it hurts Chinese companies too. SAIC paid $130 million for rights to Rover 25 and 75, only to find Nanjing building same cars under MG brand. SAIC protested, and how did the communist party rule over this issue? Both shall build cars as they wish. So SAIC's $130 million just went down the drain.

Who would invest in intellectual property in an environment like this? No one. Note that GM is engineering all the cars it sells in Chinese markets in Korea instead of China, because they fear having an R&D center in Shanghai means more design theft. Who is at loss here? China.

Kinda funny, because it hurts Chinese companies too. SAIC paid $130 million for rights to Rover 25 and 75, only to find Nanjing building same cars under MG brand. SAIC protested, and how did the communist party rule over this issue? Both shall build cars as they wish. So SAIC's $130 million just went down the drain.

Despite what SAIC may be saying to the press, I think SAIC just bought the non-exclusive rights to use those two designs in their own cars. Nanjing own the original designs.

I have not seen any evidence that the goverment has made any ruling on this issue but just issued both companies a license to build cars using their own individual IP rights.

Until recently it has been OK for China to have different rules to the rest of the world since there was no trade in cars between the two. If Chinese companies are to export/import cars then they will have to start using the same rules as everyone else. This is the reason SAIC and Nanjing were prepared to spend millions on the purchase of designs which will be legal for use worldwide. No doubt some other Chinese companies will run into serious legal problems once it becomes worthwhile people taking action.

Despite what SAIC may be saying to the press, I think SAIC just bought the non-exclusive rights to use those two designs in their own cars. Nanjing own the original designs.
British records indicate SAIC is indeed the sole owner of 25 and 75 rights. This is why Rover sales price was so low, since they had nothing to sell other than the brand and some machinery.

No doubt some other Chinese companies will run into serious legal problems once it becomes worthwhile people taking action.
Which happens to be Chery.

"Note that GM is engineering all the cars it sells in Chinese markets in Korea instead of China, because they fear having an R&D center in Shanghai means more design theft."

Presumably you aren't aware of a thing called PATAC - pan asia technical automotive centre, a JV between GM and SAIC in Pudong Shanghai, which facelifted the Buick Regal and GL8, and developed the recently launched SGM18 car (on an existing platform I believe).

And the Rover IP issue is more complicated than your understanding - the sale of IP to SAIC was a pre-cursor to a JV between SAIC and Rover or alternatively Rover being bought by SAIC. Technically, since that never happened, Rover would be entitled to cancel the contract and buy back it's IP. Just that they don't have the dosh, and presumably neither does NAC. Hence a bit of a mess has ensued.

Chery Eastar uses this ACTECO 3.0 liter VVT4 V6 engine. What kind of engine does Chevy Epica - Daewoo Magnus use?

http://www.mychery.net/forum/html/ut/attach/2006/03/03/5806918-20062251352054133-embed.jpg

Presumably you aren't aware of a thing called PATAC - pan asia technical automotive centre, a JV between GM and SAIC in Pudong Shanghai, which facelifted the Buick Regal and GL8, and developed the recently launched SGM18 car (on an existing platform I believe).
PATAC is NOT a real engineering center; engineering as meaning chassis development, powertrain, crash testing, and road performance evaluation. GM continues to develop models intended for Chinese market in Korea rather than in China. All PATAC is doing is a little localization to better suit Chinese market.

And the Rover IP issue is more complicated than your understanding - the sale of IP to SAIC was a pre-cursor to a JV between SAIC and Rover or alternatively Rover being bought by SAIC. Technically, since that never happened, Rover would be entitled to cancel the contract and buy back it's IP. Just that they don't have the dosh, and presumably neither does NAC. Hence a bit of a mess has ensued.
British patent office dictates that SAIC is the current owner of Rover IPs. The fact that SAIC's IP rights are not honored even in their homeland illustrates the problem and risks of doing any kind of R&D in China.

As long as cars sold in China are engineered overseas and depend heavily on imported parts, China cannot develop a truely competitive automotive industry.

Chery Eastar uses this ACTECO 3.0 liter VVT4 V6 engine. What kind of engine does Chevy Epica - Daewoo Magnus use?
Son Of Orient initially used Mitsubishi 2.4 engines, until AVL designed ACTECO engines became available. Magnus currently uses a Daewoo inline-6 engine but used to use GM Holden's engines, so that engine's plan was not made available to Chery during the illegal design transfer. This is the reason Chery initially used Mitsubishi engines.

Son Of Orient initially used Mitsubishi 2.4 engines, until AVL designed ACTECO engines became available. Magnus currently uses a Daewoo inline-6 engine but used to use GM Holden's engines, so that engine's plan was not made available to Chery during the illegal design transfer. This is the reason Chery initially used Mitsubishi engines.

AVL only helped Chery design the engines. The engines are still designed and made in China. and owned by Chery. Even the 1st national car of pakistan The Revo uses a Chinese engine and transmission.

AVL only helped Chery design the engines.
AVL designed the engine for a paying customer(Chery), that's it.

The engines are still designed and made in China. and owned by Chery.
Not designed, but manufactured and owned by Chery, of course. As long as Chery keeps paying the IP royalty to AVL, that is.

I would not trust Chery's engine for a while; Chery engineers did not design the engines and they do not understand how it works, it's going to be a while before Chery engineers get a full grasp of the engine designs they purchased and start ironing out bugs on their own. Until then, a hell of reliability problems with first AVL-designed Chery engines.

Daewoo? lol

Why Chery would even copy a Korean company's déjà copied vehicle? don't tell me that Korean car manufacturers did not copy anyone...or should I rephrase that the Korean copy is "re-study" not clone.

get a life~

BTW, isn't Daewoo sold to GM already?

Daewoo? lol
Sad, but true.

Why Chery would even copy a Korean company's déjà copied vehicle?
Because

1. Daewoos were copies of nobody's.
2. Chery was readily able to obtain Daewoo design plans by bribing insiders amid bankruptcy proceeding.

don't tell me that Korean car manufacturers did not copy anyone...
They never did.

You are confusing styling copying with mechanical replication. Styling copying is something that is done in the industry widely and is impossible to prove, so this is why all new cars look alike from each other. If all Chery did was styling copies, then the industry outcry wouldn't be this loud.

Mechanical replication on the other hand is totally illegal and no one ever did, until Chinese came along.

or should I rephrase that the Korean copy is "re-study" not clone.
Koreans never mechanically replicated another maker's cars with the sole exception of legally licensed vehicles. They followed the rules from the beginning, and this is why nobody ever complained of IP infringement even as Hyundai and Daewoos were unloading millions of vehicles at the US and EU ports.

BTW, isn't Daewoo sold to GM already?
Yap. Therefore GM owns all rights to past Daewoo vehicles and can ban Chery from the US and EU market with a simple lawsuit, and is clearly intending to do so.

Really? Korean cars are copies of nobody's....Koreans were very famous for ripping off other's design in the 1970s~1980s, I am sure you know that.

Yeah, you can say whatever you want, and if you have enough proof, sue CHERY, I'll support ya; otherwise shut up.

BTW, yer ID is biased enough in the first place.

Any question as to why Chery's "flagship" cannot make it outside of China???

This is why Japanese and Korean automakers don't take Chery seriously; they are nothing but a bunch of auto pirates.

Funny, how the ex-pirates commented on their Chinese little buddy. :cool:

Korean automakers don't take Chery seriously? lol I would say most American/European car makers care less about Chinese vehicles because it's evident that Chinese autos are not yet the direct competitors, but Korean? I am sure Koreans are like freaked out to see China's automobile industry rise. The only thing you can see is some not yet confirmed issue of Chery but you shamelessly claimed Chinese autoindustry to be pirates? you just made my day.

I guess you are a Hanguk saram, so very typical.

Koreans were very famous for ripping off other's design in the 1970s~1980s, I am sure you know that.
Actually I don't. Name which model they ripped off. They didn't. Unless you are confusing fully licensed vehicle productions with illgal piracy like Chery's.

if you have enough proof, sue CHERY, I'll support ya; otherwise shut up.
Volkswagen and GM sued Chery.

Korean automakers don't take Chery seriously?
They don't. The sole exception of GM Daewoo, whoses vehicle sales in China are severely affected by illegal Chery clones.

I am sure Koreans are like freaked out to see China's automobile industry rise.
They honestly don't care, with the sole exception of GM Daewoo.

Actually I don't. Name which model they ripped off. They didn't. Unless you are confusing fully licensed vehicle productions with illgal piracy like Chery's.

I have seen a lot people talking as though they didn't have a face, and you've just topped them all.




They don't. The sole exception of GM Daewoo, whoses vehicle sales in China are severely affected by illegal Chery clones.
They honestly don't care, with the sole exception of GM Daewoo.

If you don't care so much about Chinese cars, why would you be in here anyway? you don't look like interested in buying a Chinese car, the only reason you are here is to bitch about Chinese automobile, Korean automobile's future rival, in order to gain advantages.

Too bad, if you really don't take Chinese seriously, there wouldn't be trolls like you sitting behind yer puter screeny and whine all day long.

A guy like that is just beyond pathetique.

If you don't care so much about Chinese cars, why would you be in here anyway?
I am just outraged by China's shameless auto piracy.

Too bad, if you really don't take Chinese seriously, there wouldn't be trolls like you sitting behind yer puter screeny and whine all day long.
I am trying to advise people from buying a potential death trap. There are better way to spend your money than on a Chinese car.

What I would recommend to Chinese automaker is this; stay home for another 10 years, improve your product, take away market share from foreigners currently dominating the Chinese market, then come to America and Europe with some compelling cars. Then I wold wholeheartly welcome Chinese cars. The only Chinese auto company I think is taking a right approach is SAIC; this is the company to watch for. Chery and Geely aren't.

As of now, buying a Chery or Geely is like throwing your hard-earned money away on an unsafe death trap that breaks down every 10K miles.

I am just outraged by China's shameless auto piracy.


I am trying to advise people from buying a potential death trap. There are better way to spend your money than on a Chinese car.

What I would recommend to Chinese automaker is this; stay home for another 10 years, improve your product, take away market share from foreigners currently dominating the Chinese market, then come to America and Europe with some compelling cars. Then I wold wholeheartly welcome Chinese cars. The only Chinese auto company I think is taking a right approach is SAIC; this is the company to watch for. Chery and Geely aren't.

As of now, buying a Chery or Geely is like throwing your hard-earned money away on an unsafe death trap that breaks down every 10K miles.

Another shameless claim. look who's talking.....

Potential death trap? you kidding me? Chery has a fairly well reputation in China for its safty, especially the Eastar, a helluva better than Honda Accent(built in Guangzhou) of which the sale's number is still unbeatable.

Here is a list of the real death troll in the states during 1999~2002

http://www.informedforlife.org/driverdeathrates1999to2002.pdf

rank among 200 vehicles.....


53 Hyundai Sonata 1999 -2002 57 (less than "average" death rate)

109 Hyundai Elantra 1999 -2002 88 (less than "average" death rate)

159 Daewoo Leganza 1999 -2002 125 (above "average" death rate)

174 Hyundai Accent 2dr 1999 -2002 148 (above "average" death rate)

175 Hyundai Accent 4dr 1999 -2002 150 (above "average" death rate)


187 Kia Sportage 4dr 4wd 1999 -2002 162 (above "average" death rate)

195 Kia Sportage 4dr 2wd 1999 -2002 197 WORST (more than 2 x "average" death rate

196: Kia Rio 1999 -2002 200 WORST (more than 2 x "average" death rate

KIA, i bet no one would really want to buy a car that is doomed for destruction...either Killed in Action, or in Accident.

No cheap talk, you Korean guys will see in the future that Chery made automobiles are gonna compete directly with Hyundai, GM Daewoo. Nothing that special, Chery isn't even afraid of any western counterparts, you look too high of yerself, Monsieur 김/이/박.

Chery has a fairly well reputation in China for its safty, especially the Eastar
Well, that's Daewoo's safety reputation, not Chery's. Not that I would be caught driving a Daewoo; Daewoos(and their Chevrolet branded version) are death traps. Thus Chery QQ and Song Of Orient are death traps.

Honda Accent(built in Guangzhou)
Wow, Honda builds Accent. I didn't know.

53 Hyundai Sonata 1999 -2002 57 (less than "average" death rate)
109 Hyundai Elantra 1999 -2002 88 (less than "average" death rate)
This is why Hyundai is prospering.

159 Daewoo Leganza 1999 -2002 125 (above "average" death rate)
This is why Daewoo went bankrupt.

174 Hyundai Accent 2dr 1999 -2002 148 (above "average" death rate)
175 Hyundai Accent 4dr 1999 -2002 150 (above "average" death rate)
Well, subcompacts always do poorly in crash tests.

187 Kia Sportage 4dr 4wd 1999 -2002 162 (above "average" death rate)
195 Kia Sportage 4dr 2wd 1999 -2002 197 WORST (more than 2 x "average" death rate
196: Kia Rio 1999 -2002 200 WORST (more than 2 x "average" death rate
This is why Kia went bankrupt.

KIA, i bet no one would really want to buy a car that is doomed for destruction...either Killed in Action, or in Accident.
Old Kia died; new Kia is just a brand for Hyundai.

You illustrate a good point here; companies selling crap cars at cheapo price eventually go bankrupt. It happened to Japanese and Korean firms, it will too happen to Chinese firms.

The keyword to automotive success is "value", not "low price". Those offering good value at high price tend to prosper, while those emphasizing on low price tend to go the way of Kia, Daewoo, Geely, and Chery.

I am just outraged by China's shameless auto piracy.


I am trying to advise people from buying a potential death trap. There are better way to spend your money than on a Chinese car.

What I would recommend to Chinese automaker is this; stay home for another 10 years, improve your product, take away market share from foreigners currently dominating the Chinese market, then come to America and Europe with some compelling cars. Then I wold wholeheartly welcome Chinese cars. The only Chinese auto company I think is taking a right approach is SAIC; this is the company to watch for. Chery and Geely aren't.

As of now, buying a Chery or Geely is like throwing your hard-earned money away on an unsafe death trap that breaks down every 10K miles.


Chery car give better value, they have more options like leather seats, digital odometer, power win/ door locks, alloy wheels that other cars don't have and they cost less.

well wether you like it or hate , your american fellow Malcom Bricklin will bring chery to the US sooner or later , and you will be forced to see Chery new models running in the street you live in , I advise you to suicide before you see that " SHAMELESS " day !

dear lord , have pitty on our friend , and dont let him die by shock .

Just a question of curiosity Whatver ur name is , if you do have one
What car are you driving right now ?

I currently Drive a 95 Toyota Corrolla , My bros 99 Golf GTi
and My sisters Chery QQ 1.1 Automatic ( which btw she didnt die for over 2 years and she didint go to the mantiance for and she didnt even change a single spare parts , unless you consider adding a spoiler to the car is a spare part ).

Wow, Honda builds Accent. I didn't know.


I mistyped Accord to Accent. :D I am sure Honda doesn't want to have that brand.

Well, that's Daewoo's safety reputation, not Chery's. Not that I would be caught driving a Daewoo; Daewoos(and their Chevrolet branded version) are death traps. Thus Chery QQ and Song Of Orient are death traps.

Woah, another shameless assessment. I guess it is actually an insult to my intelligence to argue with you about Chinese cars.




The keyword to automotive success is "value", not "low price". Those offering good value at high price tend to prosper, while those emphasizing on low price tend to go the way of Kia, Daewoo, Geely, and Chery.

Actually this is something interesting and right. I am sure most Chinese firms know about it, and that's why Chinese brands televisions and other home electronix virtually own the domestic market, beating the Japanese SONY, Panasonic, SHARP, SANYO...etc let along Korean brands.

Chinese cellphone companies are doing the samething to gain market share in China, which is probably the most picky market on earth.

I don't think Chinese auto companies are particularly dumber.

China doesn't only make cars, we also make rockets and spaceships. :D

Like it or not, in the long run Chinese products are gonna rock, we'll see.

well wether you like it or hate , your american fellow Malcom Bricklin will bring chery to the US sooner or later , and you will be forced to see Chery new models running in the street you live in , I advise you to suicide before you see that " SHAMELESS " day !

dear lord , have pitty on our friend , and dont let him die by shock .

Just a question of curiosity Whatver ur name is , if you do have one
What car are you driving right now ?

I currently Drive a 95 Toyota Corrolla , My bros 99 Golf GTi
and My sisters Chery QQ 1.1 Automatic ( which btw she didnt die for over 2 years and she didint go to the mantiance for and she didnt even change a single spare parts , unless you consider adding a spoiler to the car is a spare part ).


cryptonx are you from Egypt?

yes, he posted in another thread he is from Egypt and was planning to buy a geely, but last minute didnt

yes, he posted in another thread he is from Egypt and was planning to buy a geely, but last minute didnt


So what car did he buy? a used 95 toyota corolla?

I think that guy that bought Chery QQ EZdrive yesterday fmohiy is from Egypt too. this guy cryptonx could answer his questions since his sister drives a QQ ezdrive too.

My sisters Chery QQ 1.1 Automatic ( which btw she didnt die for over 2 years and she didint go to the mantiance for and she didnt even change a single spare parts , unless you consider adding a spoiler to the car is a spare part ).
So the fact broke down only after two years? Totally unacceptable in the US market.

I don't think Chinese auto companies are particularly dumber.
China doesn't only make cars
Mechanical design/fabrication and eletronics are totally difficult. It takes decades of experience to put together an engine that will last 200K miles(320K) or more.

we also make rockets and spaceships.
Replicas of Russian tech.

Like it or not, in the long run Chinese products are gonna rock, we'll see.
Toyota quality does not come from Toyota; it comes from individual Toyota suppliers who supply quality parts to Toyota.

As of now, China doesn't have an automotive component industry(Hence the need to import 60% of parts from outside of China), and a few Chinese suppliers in business lack quality mind set. It will take a decade or more to build a competitive automotive component industry.

Chinese car is not ready to hit the world market until Chinese component industry is ready to compete with Japanese on quality.

So the fact broke down only after two years? Totally unacceptable in the US market.


Mechanical design/fabrication and eletronics are totally difficult. It takes decades of experience to put together an engine that will last 200K miles(320K) or more.


Replicas of Russian tech.


Toyota quality does not come from Toyota; it comes from individual Toyota suppliers who supply quality parts to Toyota.

As of now, China doesn't have an automotive component industry(Hence the need to import 60% of parts from outside of China), and a few Chinese suppliers in business lack quality mind set. It will take a decade or more to build a competitive automotive component industry.

Chinese car is not ready to hit the world market until Chinese component industry is ready to compete with Japanese on quality.


I can't believe you want to talk about componennt industry, the Hyundai automobile has such a bad reputation in dealing with the component suppliers in China. Some guy that I know actually worked with Hyundai which he described as a bounch of jerks who raised the standard of quality insanely high that the Korean suppliers themselves are not able to pass in order to block each and every Chinese part component supplier which is supposed to replace the original Korean some year after Hyundai went into China, according to the initial contract.

Replicas of Russian tech? is it that easy to copy? why don't you guys launch one and prove it that facile? I can't stand yer double standards, it's way beyond pathetic. Your shameless claim is so very typical Mr.KiMCHI.

I can't believe you want to talk about componennt industry, the Hyundai automobile has such a bad reputation in dealing with the component suppliers in China. Some guy that I know actually worked with Hyundai which he described as a bounch of jerks who raised the standard of quality insanely high that the Korean suppliers themselves are not able to pass in order to block each and every Chinese part component supplier which is supposed to replace the original Korean some year after Hyundai went into China, according to the initial contract.
Well, Hyundai competes with Toyota for the title of king of quality in the US nowadays, so they have a "quality" reputation to keep. If they didn't keep their quality that high, they would go bankrupt with their 10 year/100K warantee. They just cannot relax their quality rules in China.

I am really afraid Chery will be forced to early US market exit because of warranty claims.

Replicas of Russian tech? is it that easy to copy?
Still a copy.

Continuing with quality issue discussion, here is a quote;

http://www.ftd.de/karriere_management/business_english/63897.html

However, there are still quality concerns about Chery's cars. According to JD Power, the car consultancy, the QQ generated 30 per cent more problems than the Spark last year. When Chery starts selling in the US, nothing could scupper its brand name more quickly than persistent quality complaints.
Daewoo is known for crappy quality and Chery is even 30% worse than Daewoo. That makes Chery pretty much "unsellable" in developed markets.

You were wondering why Hyundai was so obsessed with quality; it is an issue of life or death for them; poor quality means they will be forced into bankruptcy by warranty claims. So Hyundai was forced into the position of offering top quality because of their long warranty program.

Well, Hyundai competes with Toyota for the title of king of quality in the US nowadays, so they have a "quality" reputation to keep. If they didn't keep their quality that high, they would go bankrupt with their 10 year/100K warantee. They just cannot relax their quality rules in China.

I am really afraid Chery will be forced to early US market exit because of warranty claims.

but i still will never buy a Hyundai.....


Still a copy.

Can you copy one for me? :lol:

at I hate china bla bla

First of all , I DIDNT SAY IT BROKE AFTER 2 YEARS
The car is 2 years old ( TILL TODAY ) and it hasnt BROKE DOWN even since 2 years means that it didnt break down ever !

I didnt mean that it broke down after 2 years ..

It still working perfectly fine and very very very successful and popular in Egypt especial for girls and thier price is umatched

starts at $7500 .

the closest Supermini or small hatchback is the Suzuki alto which costs $10,000 , Perodua Kelisa $10,000 , Fiat UNO Fire , $10,000

A friend of mine bought a chery A11 a year ago , he did 42,000 KMs so far and the car hasnt gone for service yet ...

the only thing that he complains is the noisey engine when he goes beyond 100km/h but its pointless cuz the speed limit in EGYPT here , is 100 km/h .

my dads toyota has been to the service for like 1000000000 times costing almost 3/4 of its price so far , from dead batteries / tyres / stupid automatic gearbox bla bla bla ..

at Hazik

Yes I am from Egypt, I have no idea about the EZ drive thing , I use the Automatic gearbox , I dont like Steptronic or whatever its called .

the Corrolla 95 is my dads , but I use it alot , but I want my own car

Currently I am very very confused between a 1.3 Italian/Brazilian Fiat Palio VS the Chery A11 , both are sold for the same price .

Import 60% of the parts? Hyundai maybe, because Korean parts are so cheap. Why? Because of patriotism - Hyundai said 'let's build a national economy, let's build cars, give me the parts cheap for the pride of Korea'. So the Korean parts makers have terrible margins, but get by because of a relatively high volume (5million cars) across a very narrow range - basically 2 manufacturers with well rationalised platforms.

Most of the VW's in China are over 90% localised, Chery probably more than this.

Component industry is huge in china - not just chinese suppliers, international companies are shutting operations in high cost countries and moving to china. Component industry won't be a thing to hold the chinese back.

Difficulty at the moment for China is lack of consolidation - lots of makers, lots of models, not many models built in really big volumes. Which is why they are looking to add export markets.

Component industry won't be a thing to hold the chinese back.
Read Honda's "Chinese auto parts quality sucks hard and we must import or purchase from Japanese owned suppliers in China a full 90% of components to build a simple compact cars that are export-worthy" rant posted in the general thread.

Component industry is huge in china - not just chinese suppliers, international companies are shutting operations in high cost countries and moving to china. Component industry won't be a thing to hold the chinese back.
So you never heard of Honda and Hyundai complaining about unavailabilty of quality components in Chinese market.

Sure, there are lots of parts makers making cheap knock-off parts; but very few can actually produce anything that are suitable for Chinese market, much less export markets.

Difficulty at the moment for China is lack of consolidation - lots of makers, lots of models, not many models built in really big volumes. Which is why they are looking to add export markets.
It will take decades before China forms a competitive component industry. Until then, Chinese auto exports are held back by a lack of quality locally sourced parts; all critical parts must be imported at great expense, making China a place as expensive or more expensive than Japan to assemble an export-grade vehicle.

mate, japanese or other foreign owned suppliers in china are part of the chinese component industry.

these companies are not signing up to your personal anti-china war, they are in china, so they are part of the chinese auto industry. they sell their parts to anybody who needs them, be they japanese, korean, western, chinese, whatever.

if there are no decent parts makers in china, why are all the OE makers setting up purchasing offices in shanghai to buy parts and ship them back to their own country for assembly.

moving component production to china has been resisted to some extent by western companies because of the pain and cost of closing operations in their home countries, but it's happening now, they need to do it to remain competitive and cut costs. look at how many US component firms are now operating under chapter 11 bankruptcy protection.

hyundai and honda might bitch a bit about the component supply, but these are two of your heralded ace vehicle manufacturers that we should be buying from. now you want to say they are dumb enough to set up plants where they can't economically build vehicles because there is no component supply base.

of course I am more into engine parts, you the man for CHASSIS, maybe that's different, certainly I have German shocks and springs and japanese tyres on my chinese motor now and it's running a lot better for it, although I haven't spent the full 500m USD on development yet so I expect your Matiz probably handles a lot better.

decades to set up? the majority of vehicle components can be produced within 2 years from greenfield by a properly managed technology transfer program and that's for precision parts such as are found in the engine. as far as I'm aware, most of the CHASSIS parts are less technically demanding and could be made quicker. Although of course we can't overlook the development of said CHASSIS which is very involved and costs 500M USD.