http://www.signonsandiego.com/news/business/20070423-0024-autoshow-brilliance-usa.html

Brilliance plans U.S. sales as early as 2007

By Fang Yan
REUTERS

12:24 a.m. April 23, 2007

SHANGHAI – Chinese automaker Shenyang Brilliance Jinbei plans to ship its first sedans to the United States as early as this year, potentially making it China's first home-grown carmaker to crack the world's largest vehicle market.

Brilliance Jinbei, a unit of Brilliance China Automotive Holdings, last year became the first of its Chinese peers to secure a major sales deal in Europe, beginning with its BS6 mid-ranged sedan priced at 19,000 to 23,000 euros ($31,270).

“We are making preparations currently and hope to ship the first batch of BS6s to the United States late this year or in early 2008,” Brilliance Jinbei President Zhigang Liu told Reuters on the sidelines of the Shanghai auto show late on Sunday.

The initial sales target and other details have yet to be worked out, he said.

Brilliance, BMW's China partner, is among a growing army of ambitious Chinese auto manufacturers, such as Geely Automobile Holdings Ltd., that aim to emulate the global success of Toyota Motor Corp.

Brilliance plans to sell 158,000 sedans to Europe over the next five years, including the BS6, following up with a coupe, a smaller sedan, a compact car and a sport utility vehicle by 2010.

Chery Automobile Co., which has made inroads into emerging markets in recent years, struck a deal with DaimlerChrysler in late 2006 to make Chrysler-branded models for Europe and other markets.

PHASED EXPANSION

Previously little-known Nanjing Automotive Group, which stunned the industry in 2005 by snapping up major assets of failed MG Rover for little more than $100 million, unveiled in March the first China-made MG cars. It plans to start selling them in British Commonwealth countries in the second half.

If these initial steps proceed smoothly, China's vehicle makers could become a force to be reckoned with in the global market, although they still rely heavily on low pricing to attract customers.

Brilliance, which also makes BMWs and Minis in a venture in northeast China, is building a new plant for its own-brand cars that will double its capacity of 150,000 units.

The group sold 200,000 vehicles, including BMW brands, in 2006 and aims to boost that figure to 300,000 units this year and to 500,000 by 2015, Liu said.

“We are restrained by capacity already but we have decided to avoid ramping up too quickly. The best strategy is to grow with the market,” he said.

He added that Brilliance, having spent at least 10 billion yuan on research and development for its sedans so far, would follow up by investing a similar amount in the next five years.

SAIC Motor Corp., a Chinese partner of both General Motors and Volkswagen AG, is spending $1.71 billion to develop its own brands.

SAIC, the country's biggest car maker, last year rolled out its first brand of its own, the Roewe, based on acquired technology, and unveiled two more models – the Roewe W2 and a Shanghai brand fuel-cell car – at the auto show.

Liu did not rule out the possibility that Brilliance would acquire competing brands, domestic or foreign, when the opportunity arises.

“Some have already made big strides down that road and we would do likewise when we grow bigger,” he said.

($1-.7356 Euro; $1-7.726 Yuan)
Zhonghua BS6 Chinese Luxury Sedan.

- Gets two stars in NHIST crash test.
- Auto-mag reviewers blast it for being so 90s.
- Fails to pass California emissions.

Zhonghua BS6 is going to haunt all Chinese brands for years, just like how Landwind tarnished Chinese brands in Europe with its 0 EuroNCAP score...

Oh wow this is great news!!!!! Out of all Chinese car makers I like Brilliance the most - the BS4 and the coupe. I can finally get my hands on one!!!

I'm not a huge fan of the current BS6, but it's not that bad of a car. I wish they would bring to the US the BS4 and the coupe first, and then the next generation BS6.

The BS4 or coupe with the 1.8 turbo, fully loaded with leather and everything, in black of course, would be what I want.

Brilliance cars really do suck. As a European I think they will bomb badly, so badly in fact that I doubt many people will complain as no one will buy them in the first place. Truly shocking and hideously built cars.

so we agree on something. Can we make the same agreement on Nanjing MGs as well?

No and I think the reason you harp on about Nanjing is because your actually pretty worried that they may be the next big car maker....

If Brilliance quality is so poor then why hasn't the European press come down hard on them like they did on other Chinese car companies like Landwind, Chang'an, Geely and Xinkai? There must be a good enough sampling on hand now for the critics to have a close look. Or hasn't HSO Trading started to bring in the first of those 158,000 units yet?

Here's what Automotive News Europe said last March: "Quality (of Brilliance at Geneva show) was definitely better than on the Chinese models from other manufacturers that were shown last autumn in Paris."

I've had the opportunity to see the BS6 last time I was in China. Though I didn't thoroughly examine it, both the int and ext looked alright. There's much to be desired but I though it was pretty good overall.

Regardless, I'm sure by the time they come to the US, they would have made the necessary adjustments to appeal to the US market.

I will buy one regardless of how it is. Heck, there are 3 million Chinese peeps in the States, if only every Chinese family buy one... ;)

I think this car doesn't look that bad. If it's priced the same as an Accord or Camry they'll sell. If you have 10 accords and 10 camrys in your work place parking lot. And you don't want to drive the exact same car as your co-workers get this car.

http://img.autohome.com.cn/upload/spec/2405/u_2405682986292.jpg

http://img.autohome.com.cn/upload/spec/2405/u_2405875854634.jpg


http://img.autohome.com.cn/upload/spec/2405/u_2405724626259.jpg

http://img.autohome.com.cn/upload/spec/2405/u_240534316195.jpg

http://www.autoblog.com/2007/04/23/the-brilliance-are-coming-chinese-automaker-plans-to-export-sed/

The Brilliance are coming! Chinese automaker plans to export sedans to the US this year
Posted Apr 23rd 2007 2:24PM by Jonathon Ramsey
Filed under: Sedans/Saloons, Etc.



After storming Europe in 2006, BMW's Chinese automaking partner Brilliance wants to start sending its BS6 sedan to our shores as soon as this year. If it does, it will be the first Chinese car maker to grace the US market.

According to Brilliance President Zhigang Liu, if the BS6's don't make it this year, then we'll get them in early 2008. When they arrive, you will know them by their . . . well, you won't actually know them, because each one looks like several different cars depending on where you stand. A resurrected and chromed-out Rover grill on a whatchamacallit front end, a perfectly nondescript profile, and a done-a-million-times Southeast Asian rear. The automotive equivalent of jambalaya, it's got a little bit of everything in it. Still, it's hard to say anything bad about the car. At least not the one in the picture.

Brilliance has put $1.3 billion into R&D for its line of sedans, and will invest that amount again over the next five years. As well, the company builds BMW's and Minis in Northeast China, so they should have a some sort of handle on quality control. There are no sales targets set yet, but we practically guarantee they can up their target if they swap the letters "BS" -- which probably stand for Shenyang Brilliance -- for almost anything else.

[Source: Reuters]

I think this car doesn't look that bad. If it's priced the same as an Accord or Camry they'll sell.
So you don't understand American drivers.

I say Zhonghua might sell a few thousands if it is priced at $13,000 with a full leather interior, automatic transmission, etc and comes with a 100K warranty. Other than that buyers will pass.

If it's priced the same as it is in Europe $26,000. they'll sell a few thousand just to Chinese people in california who want a car that saids they're proud to be Chinese.

Can't agree with you more on that! :thumb:

Chinese are unlike koreans who are extremly superfacial. If you ever go to a korean food market or a korean church on Sunday you will see all koreans drive Japanese cars.... despite the unity and partitism they trying so hard to sell to everyone else..

Even folks like REAL_I_HATE_CHINA drives a second hand Camry around instead a brand new shinny but crappy hundai that only that costs sub 8000 with 100k warrranty... tell me they are not hypocrites.

:lol:


.

So you don't understand American drivers.

I say Zhonghua might sell a few thousands if it is priced at $13,000 with a full leather interior, automatic transmission, etc and comes with a 100K warranty. Other than that buyers will pass.

Yeah, like YOU understand American drivers...

At this price, equipment level, and warranty, Zhonghua will sell by the hundreds of thousands. Remember the used car market outsells new cars by 3 to 1, so people by far look for value and bargains and don't want to spend a lot of money on transportation.

If it's priced the same as it is in Europe $26,000. they'll sell a few thousand just to Chinese people in california who want a car that saids they're proud to be Chinese.

Hey, you just described ME!

I highly doubt they will sell a fully loaded BS6 in the US for $26K. Everything is more expensive in EU vs US, by as much as 60%.

My guess is the BS6 will sell in the US, fully loaded with leather, moonroof, auto, etc. etc., for less than $20K, along with 10 year warranties, free road side assistance, and free full maintenance.

That's the only way to instill confidence and alleviate concerns in the consumers - the only way to succeed.

My guess is the BS6 will sell in the US, fully loaded with leather, moonroof, auto, etc. etc., for less than $20K, along with 10 year warranties, free road side assistance, and free full maintenance.
Suzuki Verona(Aka Daewoo Magnus) had exactly all that, plus a six banger for $19,999 and it flopped.

On the other hand, Suzuki Forenza(Daewoo Lacetti) is the best selling Suzuki accounting for half of Suzuki's US sales because it is priced at $14,000 loaded.

So that should give you an idea of what kind of a price Brilliance could charge.

Suzuki had these cars? I almost forgot about them... can't remember if I ever seen an ad or commercial on these cars. Well, since Suzuki no longer sell any mid-size or bigger sedans, that leaves a big hole for Brilliance :thumb:

Sales and marketing (also PR) is just as import as the overall value of the cars themselves. This is one area Suzuki is failing and hopefully Chinese cars makers learn from their mistakes.

Btw, Suzuki's warranty is not that great. 3 year 36K mi on everything, only powertrain is 7 year 100K. No big deal. I propose Brilliance (or any other Chinese car company) to throw in free full maintenance for the duration of the warranty. Not only is that a huge value for the consumers, Brilliance can closely monitor the quality and reliability of their cars, and to ensure the cars are properly maintained - and likely translate to reduced warranty claims. It's a terrific strategy for any new car company. (To recoup some of the cost, sell the cars for $900 more, consumers won't even notice it.) Yet another plus is this brings traffic to the dealer, which helps sell more cars, accessories, and other services.

Suzuki had these cars? I almost forgot about them... can't remember if I ever seen an ad or commercial on these cars. Well, since Suzuki no longer sell any mid-size or bigger sedans, that leaves a big hole for Brilliance :thumb:
Nobody's gonna pay $20K for a Chinese brand car. The market doesn't exist.

I propose Brilliance (or any other Chinese car company) to throw in free full maintenance for the duration of the warranty.
And go bankrupt paying for repairs in the process. Not even BMW would keep the free maintenance program citing the cost.

Based on the sales history of Daewoos, the maximum that US drivers will pay for a Non-(Japanse/Hyundai) Asian car is $14,000.

Based on what I have seen so far, Brilliance has a pricing problem that prevents it from $14,000 price bracket. Throw in the huge warranty cost from poor quality and why Brilliance would make a relatively quickly exit from the US market.

What about going in through Canada and testing the waters there first like Hyundain did? If they go to the US it's got to be right the first time, as Renault, Fiat, Daewoo, Stirling and Daihatsu found out to their peril.

I agree with RIHC's original post, BS6 will fail emissions, safety & build standards and will tarnish the Chinese name for building cars like the Landwind did in Europe.

No doubt about it. If Brilliance is not ready for the US market, PLEASE DON'T COME! Only come to the US when all criterias are met - so hurry!!!!

Can't agree with you more on that! :thumb:
...

I AGREE COMPLETELY.

Koreans are the most superficial, shallow, simple minded people on earth. They are all about image and no content. That's why despite their obnoxious personality and constant ranting about their "superiority" (which is quite laughable considering they have always been the runt nation amongst East Asians), they NEVER buy their own brand of cars when given a choice. I live in California, and in both the bay area and LA, which have HUGE numbers of Koreans, I have ONLY ONCE met a Korean who bought a Korean brand car, a Hyundai. ONLY ONCE. The vast majority buy Japanese cars because they are image conscious and they don't want to be personally associated with the poor brand image of Hyundai. That's exactly how superficial they are.

Also, if you notice how Koreans constantly talk about their "superiority", they will constantly harp on how good looking they are. This is pure BS. There are a few good looking Koreans, but the vast majority are plain to ugly, and when they are ugly, they REALLY FUCKING UGLY. I mean, seriously deformed features. Because I am tall, muscular and handsome, Koreans are constantly coming up to me and saying, wow, you look Korean. I don't take it as a compliment. I tell them, NO, I look Chinese. Don't tell me I look Korean when most of them are a half foot shorter than me, while when I've been to parts of Northern China my 6'2 frame was about average compared to all the tall people around me.

One thing about Koreans, they are as obnoxious as possible, and even though they keep repping about their superiority, they suffer from a deep inferiority complex. Which is why Korean Americans NEVER BUY HYUNDAIS. In the end, their insecurities and need to have a good image wins out over their stupid superficial pride.

I actually bought my first car off a Korean couple.
It was a Ford Taurus.
I hadn't got my driver's license back then, so they were kind enough to drop off the car at my apartment and drove back in their Grand Cherokee.
When I asked them which car they liked most, the answer was Hyundai Sonata.
I didn't spot that car in their garage though.

http://www.signonsandiego.com/news/business/20070423-0024-autoshow-brilliance-usa.html


Zhonghua BS6 Chinese Luxury Sedan.

- Gets two stars in NHIST crash test.
- Auto-mag reviewers blast it for being so 90s.
- Fails to pass California emissions.

Zhonghua BS6 is going to haunt all Chinese brands for years, just like how Landwind tarnished Chinese brands in Europe with its 0 EuroNCAP score...
It's a "gloomy future" (http://chinacarforums.com/forum/showthread.php?t=2333) anyway, so what the heck, fuck it.

Koreans are the most superficial, shallow, simple minded people on earth.

Can you be a little less racist, that was rude. I'm sure you've never
been to Korea, and stereotypes aren't always true.

they NEVER buy their own brand of cars when given a choice. I live in California, and in both the bay area and LA, which have HUGE numbers of Koreans, I have ONLY ONCE met a Korean who bought a Korean brand car, a Hyundai. ONLY ONCE. The vast majority buy Japanese cars because they are image conscious and they don't want to be personally associated with the poor brand image of Hyundai. That's exactly how superficial they are.

In Korea, Korean cars have over 90% market share. (Lexus was the top
importer with about 6000-7000 cars sold).

The only reason why Korean cars completely dominant their domestic market is because the Korean govt. SHUTS OFF foreign competition and foreign brands. Maybe in recent years, they have allowed a trickle of foreign brands into the country, but Korea is nowhere as open as China is when it comes to trade and investment.

Seems you have a problem when people respond with fire to that crackhead, but you don't have a problem with him leaving racist comments on every corner of this board.

I don't see why they have to fight head on this extremely competitive market.
It's not like everyone in the USA is rich, or likes luxury. For one, it's not me. I
say bring a simple design, preferably a van under $15k, that works and lasts.

There are millions of people just surviving (many of them illegal immigrants).
For them paying extra for things like leather interior is just plain dumb. But if
they can go to a junk yard, and unbolt some mechanical component in case it
fails - that's a huge advantage.

Face it, those with money will never opt for a Chinese luxury car - they are in
general conservative people, with appreciation for value. It's the indigent who
are prone to taking chances, and this is where Chinese cars should belong.

Dmitry for vans, albeit small ones, coming to the U.S., keep your eye on Shanghai-General Motors Wuling Auto. They are hot......

Excuse me, Dragin, what do you mean hot? Cute? Then it is exactly what I
do not need. My 89 Toyota Van LE looks like a brick, according to my wife,
but it has 283k trouble free miles, and I always use cheap spare parts. And
every time I pull next to some pretty american made pickup truck or van my
face gets a sly smile, because they are all just grossly uncompetitive.

SGM Wuling grew by more than 35% last year. That subsidiary 0f SGM produced more than half of SGM's 2006 total sales. They are being exported to India, Indonesia, the Mideast and South America so far.
Have a look at the website: www.sgmw.com.cn

Cheap spare parts for a Toyota.....that almost seems too good to believe......they must be made in China

The only reason why Korean cars completely dominant their domestic market is because the Korean govt. SHUTS OFF foreign competition and foreign brands. Maybe in recent years, they have allowed a trickle of foreign brands into the country, but Korea is nowhere as open as China is when it comes to trade and investment.
Actually there was a news article on Chinese newspapers about 10 Chinese misconception of the world early this year in hopes of broadening average Chinese's understanding of the outside of the world, and the very misconception abut Korean auto market was discussed.

Obviously, Korean auto indutry is much more wide open to foreigners than China, 4 out of 5 auto manufacturers in Korea are foreign owned(GM, Renault, SAIC, and Tata), the import tariff is only 10%(same as Europe), and there is no restriction on foreign ownership of automobile and auto parts makers. Even worse, turn on the TV and nobody drives around in Korean brand cars anymore.

The reason foreign brands do poorly against Hyundai/Kia is that their offerings are not competitive. Only two mass-market auto manufacturers in the world put out higher quality vehicles than Hyundai does for the moment, Toyota and Honda. But these two don't want to price compete in Korea, so these customers really don't have a choice. You cannot find a foreign brand vehicle with better quality and the tight service network at a price premium of say 15%, so they are back to Hyundai/Kia showroom every time.

Tata and Briliance tried to sell Indica and Zhonghua, but they gave up after figuring out that they couldn't undercut Hyundai's prices by more than $1000~$2000.

[QUOTE=Real_I_Hate_China] 4 out of 5 auto manufacturers in Korea are foreign owned(GM, Renault, SAIC, and Tata).
GM has (GM)Daewoo, Renault has (Renault) Samsung, and SAIC has
Ssangyong, but who does Tata own? (Note, Hyundai and Kia are
owned by Hyundai).

who does Tata own?
Daewoo's mid-heavy truck/tractor business.

Tata does have a distribution network in Korea and this is why Tata tried to distribute Indica in Korea, but gave up because Indica was not competitive enough.

The reason for Brilliance's North Korean factory is not to serve North Korea, but to ship BS4 and BS6 to Korea since anything made in North Korea is considered domestically manufactured in the south and are exempt from import tariff. Even with this, Brilliance's calculations showed they still couldn't compete with present models.

There has been no shortage of news relating to the Chinese auto industryas of late. There's a lot of buzz regarding Buick, BMW and Audi and their displays at the Shanghai International Auto Show, not to mention the many domestic market debuts, but the question we all want to know is which Chinese automaker is going to be the first to break into North America, and whether or not that company might be Chery due to its relationship with Chrysler Group (Chery is building Chrysler's upcoming B-segment car).

It now appears that a new player is serious about the North American market, and it's not industry giants SAIC and FAW, nor is it Geely which showcased one of its cars at Detroit a couple of years ago. The manufacturer that's stepping up to the plate is Brilliance, and according to a recent report they're going to be doing it with the BS4 and BS6 sedans.

Brilliance might not be China's largest automaker, but it has landed some very important firsts. For instance, it built the first mass-produced Chinese passenger car endowed with its own intellectualproperty rights; prior to that Chinese automakers licensed (or ripped off) generic clones. From there, Brilliance became the first Chinese automaker to design and build a car to be sold in Europe, which took place in 2006. It only makes sense that North America is next.

The sedans that Brilliance intends on shipping to America were developed in collaboration with some of the best parts and skills suppliers in the industry. Giugiaro and Italdesign contributed to the look of the body, which while a little anonymous looks handsome and sophisticated enough. As a consultant, Porsche worked on chassis dynamics, tuning ride and handling, while Mitsubishi backed the project by providing 2.0- and 2.4-liter inline four-cylinder engines.

As an assembly partner to BMW for Chinese-market products, the Bavarian firm also providedexpertise in quality control to bring Brilliance's initial perceived quality up a notch or two. It's worth noting that the Chinese-market MINI and 3-Series are built by Brilliance too, so we've got high hopes for the interior and quality of the BS4/6.

From what we know, the German media that have driven the BS6 praised it for being a good high-speed cruising vehicle, thanks to its advanced five-link rear suspension with passive rear-wheel steering.

According to Brilliance's president, Zhigang Liu, the BS6 is schedule to arrive not by 2012, or 2010, but by the end of this year. If it fails to hit the market within the next eight months, it'll be in early 2008, which is remarkably quick given that the company only announced its intentions recently.

Chery, SAIC, FAW, Geely and others might want to take note, as there may be some benefit to arriving in North America first. Then again, larger Chinese automakers may be hoping that a smaller firm like Brilliance will take any initial criticism North American auto journalists and analysts have to dish out, so that they can slide through the back door on a more solid footing.

Early 2008 is not far off. So who will win the prize of exclusive agent and importer in the U.S.? Looks like Brilliance dumped Euro Motors in Europe when it ultimately decided to go with HSO Motors of Luxemborg.
Did the same thing happen to these U.S.-based wannabes seen at the websites below? The outdated look of them would seem to indicate such.

http://www.chinacarusa.com/
http://www.globalautoholdings.com/
http://www.amasiainternational.com/

I think Nanjing is aiming to be in the USA in 2008 with MG....

I really don't think it matters who gets there first, it's what impression they create when they get there. Brilliance got wripped apart by the German and UK press when they launched there and although the US can be less demanding I still think this is a big ask for them. Their cars simply aren't good enough yet.

Just compare the Zhongua to the MG 7 from Nanjing. The MG is acceptable to the USA because the fit and finish is excellent and it has a great brand. Brilliance has neither. Develop some decent models first before trying this.

Korean market only opened up after domestic makers such as Hyundai fully saturated and entrenched the market, where outsiders will have a hard time getting in - very much like what Japan did.

At one point, Korea cars dominate some 98% of the market. Due to international pressure, Korea is now more open (in order to export, it must import. Still, export greatly exceed import, by a huge margin.)

Either the MG7 or the BS4, both will look good on my drive way :thumb: Though I'd take the MG7 for the brand recognition and luxury touches.

...Even worse, turn on the TV and nobody drives around in Korean brand cars anymore.

koreans are extremly narrow-minded, you don't need to run ads on TV everyday to remind them, they grow up in a culture that is extremly narrow-minded and resistis everything/everyone foreign.

...
..Only two mass-market auto manufacturers in the world put out higher quality vehicles than Hyundai does for the moment, Toyota and Honda.

There is nothing high quality about hundai/kie, they are mediocre at the best. Only koreans think they are actually making something durable, another example how narrow their view is.


.

I think the culture may have played a big part here. Heard that in Korea, seniority is such a big deal that you should not out-drive your boss, or anyone with a higher position in your work, etc. For example, when your supervisor drives a Sonata, you better get yourself a Elantra or something like that.

There is nothing high quality about hundai/kie, they are mediocre at the best.
I am basing this on the Consumer Report's latest long term reliability report.

I think the culture may have played a big part here. Heard that in Korea, seniority is such a big deal that you should not out-drive your boss, or anyone with a higher position in your work, etc. For example, when your supervisor drives a Sonata, you better get yourself a Elantra or something like that.
It has nothing to do with culture and everything to do with economics. Hard to afford a bigger vehicle on a salaryman's salary with a punitive auto taxation system(the government really really doesn't want you to own a car, but rather use public transportation system or drive a mini car to save on gas). Those in higher rank either has the company issuing the company car or subsidizing its ownership cost, the lower ranking workers don't get that.

China Cars USA nade a presentation to automobile dealers in New York last week, I heard that it was professional, and impressive.

Hey, you just described ME!

I highly doubt they will sell a fully loaded BS6 in the US for $26K. Everything is more expensive in EU vs US, by as much as 60%.

My guess is the BS6 will sell in the US, fully loaded with leather, moonroof, auto, etc. etc., for less than $20K, along with 10 year warranties, free road side assistance, and free full maintenance.

That's the only way to instill confidence and alleviate concerns in the consumers - the only way to succeed.

Worked for Hyundai (the 10 year warranty part). They were considered a half step above a Yugo when they started in the US in the mid-1980's. Once they started with the ten year warranty, they became a major player. Of course, they have at least an acceptable level of product to back it up.

Oh, and for Hyundai's reliability rating, the current Consumer Reports has the Hyundai nameplate in seventh place, overall, in predicted reliability for new cars. The top six companies are all Toyota or Honda affliates.

In order:

1. Toyota
2. Honda
3. Scion (Toyota's US-only "youth brand")
4. Acura (Honda's luxury brand)
5. Lexus (Toyota's luxury brand)
6. Subaru (Toyota recent bought a 8.7% share of Subaru off of GM)
7. Hyundai

Kia is lower, in 17th place.

Last place (36th) is Mercedes-Benz, which goes to show luxury doesn't equal reliability.

What about going in through Canada and testing the waters there first like Hyundain did? If they go to the US it's got to be right the first time, as Renault, Fiat, Daewoo, Stirling and Daihatsu found out to their peril.

That's a decent idea too. I once heard that Geely was going to try Puerto Rico first, which would be an interesting twist, since cars sold there must meet US standards (it is a US territory after all) but any bad press wouldn't spread to the continental US much. However, the Puerto Rico market is not really a good representative of the continental US market.

China Cars USA nade a presentation to automobile dealers in New York last week, I heard that it was professional, and impressive.

You are probably referring to this report from Peter M. DeLorenzo:

Publisher's Note: I had the pleasure of attending (and speaking at) the Bel Air Partners Elite Dealer Summit in New York last week, a very interesting gathering of top dealers and dealer groups from all over the country. The focus of the meeting was the emerging Chinese automobile industry and the eventual reality of Chinese vehicles being imported here. There were a series of speakers on Thursday and Friday, but by far the most interesting sequence occurred when Malcolm Bricklin did a presentation, followed shortly by a representative from Brilliance China Automotive. Always entertaining and filled with quips and funny lines, Bricklin got up and promised he would be back - this time importing Chinese hybrid vehicles, after first settling his dispute with Chery (Daimler AG waltzed-in and took Chery out from under him, according to Bricklin). All of the usual promises and hype - a Bricklin specialty - were made in vintage loosey-goosey style, and Malcolm even waved around poster boards with artist's rendering of his proposed "world-beater" Chinese car. Of course, he alluded to the fact that he had all of the problems associated with this advanced technology solved and that his partners had figured out the whole battery "thing" and then he was gone, leaving everybody wondering if there was anything there "there" - per usual. But Bricklin's misfortune was that after a break the representative from Brilliance China Automotive got up and proceeded to deliver the most buttoned-up, detailed and seamless presentation you can imagine, delineating every detail from vehicle importation sites, sales regions, product development and testing all the way to product photos and even initial pricing. Everyone in the room couldn't help but be impressed, and everyone in attendance that day knew they were witnessing the beginnings of the first serious Chinese threat to the status quo in the U.S. market. What I also took away from that meeting was that Brilliance China Automotive effectively put an end to Malcolm Bricklin's career. The juxtaposition between the two presenters was painfully striking, with Bricklin and all of his smoke and mirrors bluster going up against a thoroughly detailed presentation perfectly suited to the new century and the global scope of the automobile business. - PMD

Bel Air Partners who is very involved with USA dealers have conferences in the west and east, the east conference this year covered the arrival of Chinese cars.

These conferences are attended by "decision makers" from most of the publicly traded dealer goups.

Peter DeLorenzo was invited to be a guest speaker...that is the article I was referring to.

Hyundai started selling cars in Canada in the mid 80's, they even opened an assembly plant in Quebec at that time. The initial euphoria lasted for a while, then Hyundai receded from the Canadian market and it took a few years to gain momentum again.

Hyundai is attempting to go upstream with their product line to protect themselves from low priced competitors.

The present USA automotive market is "overdealered" which presents a unique opportunity for a "new entrant" to gain a foothold in the market.

Come up with a product that is competitively priced for what it is, offer a free maintenance package for a specific period of time, offer a warranty that instills mid term confidence in the consumer, accompanied by an aggressive financial package.

Oh, and for Hyundai's reliability rating, the current Consumer Reports has the Hyundai nameplate in seventh place, overall, in predicted reliability for new cars. The top six companies are all Toyota or Honda affliates.
That's why I said there are only two automobile companies that produce more reliable cars that Hyundai does on earth, Toyota and Honda.

I'll believe it when I see it ;)

The Brilliance Grandeur and Splendor are currently being tested and validated for the EPA/NHTSA by FEV & EDAG in Detroit, Michigan. The emissions, fuel economy, OBD, crash/safety, illumination, chassis interior - exterior are 75% complete and to date the results are "very positive". Brilliance Auto has quietly gone about making the product improvements required to bring high quality sedans into the U.S. market and their efforts are paying off. They have also quietly partnered with key U.S. automotive executives to prepare for the next asian invasion by recruiting the "who's who" of distributors and dealer automotive groups in the U.S.
Without a doubt, Brilliance Auto will be the first to market in the U.S. with over 160 dealers in place by October, 2007. Why haven't you heard about this? "Talk is cheap . . . action speaks louder than words."
There is a lot to be said for Brilliance Auto staying under the radar until it makes a national certification announcement. STAY TUNED!

WOW

This is big news I didn't know they were that into it.

Nice I love hearing good news from brilliance. I wish the best for brilliance, I know they will do well. They always remember to do their own homeworks although getting help from the German side. Brillance hardly (or never) copy any design from other makes.If brilliance passes all the tests, it can improve the image of Chinese cars in general, hope something like other Chinese will not happen to brilliance. Seriously I see no hope no Chery or Geely, they copy too much and the quality is quite low as well. GO GO GO BRILLIANCE.

The Brilliance Grandeur and Splendor are currently being tested and validated for the EPA/NHTSA by FEV & EDAG in Detroit, Michigan. The emissions, fuel economy, OBD, crash/safety, illumination, chassis interior - exterior are 75% complete and to date the results are "very positive". Brilliance Auto has quietly gone about making the product improvements required to bring high quality sedans into the U.S. market and their efforts are paying off. They have also quietly partnered with key U.S. automotive executives to prepare for the next asian invasion by recruiting the "who's who" of distributors and dealer automotive groups in the U.S.
Without a doubt, Brilliance Auto will be the first to market in the U.S. with over 160 dealers in place by October, 2007. Why haven't you heard about this? "Talk is cheap . . . action speaks louder than words."
There is a lot to be said for Brilliance Auto staying under the radar until it makes a national certification announcement. STAY TUNED!
They really seems to know what they're doing - I'm very excited about this!

I sincerely hope they cover all grounds and do this right, right off the bat. Good luck!!! I got my check book ready...

Why rush in with a product that's going to get hammered by the press and US safety groups? I just think they should concentrate on getting the product right and selling it in China first.

deleted by martin_krpan
reason: cleanup

Chinese cars are again one step closer reaching US shores :)

http://www.autoblog.com/2007/07/03/brilliance-to-get-a-2008-u-s-debut/

http://www.businessweek.com/magazine/content/07_28/c4042003.htm?chan=search#ZZZKETKVG3F

"Detroit is now bracing for an invasion of Chinese cars. Brilliance China Automotive (CBA ) plans to roll out at least one vehicle in the U.S. next year, with the help of Scottsdale (Ariz.) distributor China Motor, which is expected to showcase its plans in Detroit in July. China Motor is set to launch a $20,000 vehicle, which it has been certifying for U.S. safety and emission requirements. Brilliance is already testing the waters in Europe with a $30,000 sedan and says it will introduce at least two more models there next year.

Other Chinese carmakers are also eyeing the U.S. market. Geely Automotive began testing a $10,000 subcompact in Puerto Rico last year, with the idea of selling it stateside in 2009. And in early June, Hebei Zhongxing Automobile said it hopes to export three vehicles to the U.S. in 2008. It also plans to build a plant in Mexico. There's no certainty that all these deals will gel. But already, about 100 U.S. dealers want to carry Brilliance vehicles, according to China Motor chief David Shelburg. Says Sheldon Sandler, founder of Bel Air Partners, a financial adviser to dealerships: "They don't want to have to say later that they missed out on the next Toyota."


China Motors website: http://autokam.us/

Brilliance to pull shares from NYSE
By Jin Jing 2007-7-10

BRILLIANCE China Automotive Holdings says it remains confident about an aggressive export plan and its overall future even as it moves to delist its shares from the New York Stock Exchange.

The board members of Brilliance, which started trading on the NYSE in 1992 as the first Chinese automotive company, have reached an agreement to leave the US stock market as a result of declining trade volume and rising administrative costs, according to a statement filed with the Hong Kong Stock Exchange on Thursday.

The NYSE has been notified of the company's intention, Brilliance said in the statement, without providing a timetable for the delisting. The shares will continue to trade on the over-the-counter market.

"Our business will not be affected as most of our shares are traded on the Hong Kong stock market, where investors have more interest in mainland companies," Lisa Ng, vice president of Brilliance China, said in a telephone interview yesterday.

Brilliance China raised US$80 million in its initial public offering in New York in 1992. It began trading shares on the Hong Kong bourse in 1999.

Company shares closed at US$27.76 on Friday, after trading as high as US$29.98 in the past year.

"The car maker is generating less money on the NYSE market because of falling volume despite a climbing trading price," said Duan Chengwu, an auto analyst from Global Insight Co Ltd in Shanghai. "Overseas investors are less interested in Brilliance China, partly because of its low profitability."

The Chinese partner of BMW AG has lost money over the past two years as a result of intensified market competition and declining car prices.

Brilliance reported a loss of 398 million yuan (US$52 million) last year following a loss of US$85 million in 2005.

But the company indicated that it is well on its way to turning itself around after boosting sales of its self-branded models as well as increasing exports to overseas markets.

It has rolled out several passenger cars under its own Zhonghua brand, preparing for sales on the US market as early as 2009 after exporting to the European market last year.

The car maker earlier expects to break even this year after setting a sales target of 300,000 units, an increase of 34 percent from last year.

In its five year plan ended by 2010, Brilliance also aims to double sales to at least 500,000 units with a revenue of 80 billion yuan.

Shanghai Daily

Shifting Gears
By GONG ZHENGZHENG(China Daily)
Updated: 2007-07-16 06:44

Brilliance China Auto, the partner of German luxury carmaker BMW, says it plans to make its mark in the United States with its own-brand cars. The move comes on the back of the automaker's recent decision to withdraw its listing on the New York Stock Exchange (NYSE).

The company says that it is in discussions with some unnamed American firms to foray into the world's biggest but most demanding vehicle market.

The first model planned for the US market is a Zhonghua Zunchi 1.8-liter turbo mid-sized sedan, which has passed testing in the country, Brilliance says.

"We believe that we will make some headway in the US soon," it says, without revealing a timeframe and sales goal.

The plan comes on the back of a recent decision to withdraw its American Depositary Shares, which represent 100 ordinary shares per 1 cent of the firm, due to its wilting trade volume and rising administrative costs.

The company surprised the corporate community in China in 1992 when it was registered in Bermuda by its former controversial chairman Yang Rong, and floated in New York.

But the carmaker says it will keep its listing in Hong Kong, which dates back to 1999.

Michael Yang, executive director of NYSE Group Asia-Pacific, sees Brilliance's NYSE delisting plan as nothing strange.

"It's a normal move as the company has been unable to raise enough money (on the NYSE) - although it's a pity for us," Yang says.

Brilliance is already focused on the Hong Kong stock market, which is the biggest overseas stock destination for mainland companies.

Analysts say it will possibly return to the thriving domestic stock market to raise money to fund its expansion in China and overseas.

Brilliance says the US export drive is an important part of its ambitious goal to sell more than 30 percent of its vehicles annually by 2010, up from 3.1 percent last year.

Meanwhile, the company aims to boost its overall sales to 500,000 vehicles from 210,000 units, it says.

In the first half of this year, its sales surged by 57 percent to 146,000 vehicles, including more than 7,000 units sold abroad.

Brilliance is making the Zhonghua sedans and mini-vans under another own-brand Jinbei at its home base in the northeastern city of Shenyang. It also runs a joint venture with BMW in the city, assembling the 3 and 5 Series sedans.

Last December, the Chinese carmaker secured a deal to ship a total of 158,000 sedans to Europe in the next five years.

But it has faced a safety problem in Europe as the BS6 only achieved a rating of one star out of five in a recent crash test by Germany's ADAC auto club, making headlines in German newspapers.

A BS6 dealership in Antwerp, Belgium last week halted sales of the sedan.

Brilliance accused German media of "viciously playing up" the test results, saying it will improve the BS6's quality and strive to reach a rating of three stars within a year.

It stresses that the issue will not affect its plan in Europe and it will further extend its sales and service networks there.

The company is also building a 150,000-unit plant in the smaller southwestern city of Mianyang, partly to further explore the Southeast Asian market.

The new plant, to be operational next year, will make Brilliance's own-brand Jinbei mini-vans, pickups, light trucks and sport utility vehicles.

Brilliance also runs a plant in Vietnam making Jinbei light trucks with kits from China.

The group also has a plant in Egypt to assemble the Zhonghua sedans.

It is building another plant in the Democratic People's Republic of Korea with the Republic of Korea's industrial group PMC to make the Jinbei mini-vans.

Brilliance says it plans to increase the total number of its overseas dealerships to 53 at the end of this year from 41 at present.

A legion of other Chinese carmakers including Chery and Geely are also speeding up their overseas expansions.

China's overall vehicle exports jumped by two-thirds to 188,700 units in the first five months of this year from a year ago, according to industry data.

Rocket lifts Brilliance bid to enter US market
Buyout firm to invest US$100m in carmaker
Kandy Wong
Mar 11, 2008
United States private equity group Rocket Capital Investment is investing US$100 million in Brilliance China Automotive Holdings (SEHK: 1114) as part of the mainland carmaker's move to tap the US market

very good news for CBA i think!

Brilliance to show cars at 2009 NAIAS

August 20, 2008 - Brilliance, the state-owned automaker that produces BMWs in China under a joint venture with the German automaker, has announced that it intends to show 2009 models at the North American International Auto Show in Detroit in January.

Though Chinese automakers showing vehicles in Detroit is nothing new, a spokesperson for Brilliance told Automotive News China that the carmaker is serious about selling cars in the United States during the 2009 calendar year.

Apparently, two Brilliance models - the midsize BS4 and larger BS6 - were sent to the United States in 2007 for emissions and crash testing. Brilliance’s Vice President, He Gouhua, says that the cars passed the safety testing but not the emissions testing. Still, we have to wonder what structural modifications were made between 2006 - when the car flunked a German test - and 2007.

Brilliance plans to show off the BS4 and BS6, as well as the recently-introduced BS3 coupe and FRV hatchback in Detroit.

source: leftlanenews.com

Brilliance delays auto exports to US by two years

January 16, 2009 - Brilliance China Automotive Holdings Ltd will delay vehicle exports to the United States by two years although its debut at the ongoing Detroit Autoshow is helping the firm to build up its brand image, according to a company source.

"A lot of factors, including which products to export and how to cooperate with overseas partners, remained uncertain," said the official in charge of overseas expansion. "We are still in the early stages of our entry to the United States. But it's a good time for us to finish the preparations amid a market downturn."

Brilliance Auto, the Chinese partner of Germany's BMW, had earlier planned to sell sedans under its Brilliance brand in the US in the first quarter of this year with partner Autokam Ltd. Exports to Germany started in 2006.

Slack demand

But the global financial crisis has hit the Big Three US car makers and resulted in slack demand for new vehicles. Other global car brands are cutting prices to bolster sales which eroded a major advantage of Chinese-made vehicles ?? their prices. This poses greater difficulties for Chinese car makers' overseas expansion. Other problems cited include safety concerns and having to create awareness of a new name to US consumers.

The company official said entering the US market would still remain a top priority and to this end Brilliance made its first appearance at the auto show with four models.

source: Shanghai Daily

Is 2 years an appropriate time frame to enter the US market.

I think it may be longer as the current economic crisis isn't going to improve for sometime.

It's been awhile since we got Raul's update (seen above) on Brilliance in the United States of America, but now trade publication Wards tells us that Brilliance's arrival may finally be approaching and, that some Saturn dealers may be a part of it.
Will David Shelburg's prediction that he'd be the first in the U.S. with a Chinese passenger car actually come to pass? We shall see.........

Via Autoline we hear this:

According to Wards, a few Saturn dealers have agreed to sell Brilliance cars. The Auto-Kam Automotive Group is the official franchiser and distributor of Brilliance cars in the U.S. and says it has over 30 locations to sell vehicles including the Saturn ones. Brilliance says it will sell cars in the American market next year as long as they pass safety testing.

lol it will never happen, because Saturn themselves are near being shelved.

Lets face it; Pyongwha has a better chance of reaching US soil:rolleyes: .

Brilliance cars really do suck. As a European I think they will bomb badly, so badly in fact that I doubt many people will complain as no one will buy them in the first place. Truly shocking and hideously built cars.

Do tell us how you really feel about Brilliance automobiles, james 123.

lol it will never happen, because Saturn themselves are near being shelved.

Lets face it; Pyongwha has a better chance of reaching US soil:rolleyes: .

Saturn dealers are signing up to become Brilliance dealers. Saturn is no more effectively.

But the fixed assets and the expertise are still there, and that's what Brilliance, and all the others need, to make a successful entry.

I knew BYD was going to be at the Detroit Auto show this year but was surprised to see that Brilliance was there again as well. Apparently Brilliance is still working on building a U.S. dealer network, and the Kelley Auto Group is one of the signers as can be gathered from this video:

http://www.theautochannel.com/news/2009/01/14/363823.html

Tiny vehicle maker, Li Shi Guang Ming also popped up again this year....