SHANGHAI, Sept 5 (Reuters) - China's Great Wall Motor Co. Ltd. (2333.HK: Quote, Profile, Research) said on Tuesday its has exported 500 sports utility vehicles (SUV) to Italy, its first batch of shipments to the highly competitive Western European market.

"We hope to sell more there in the future, and hopefully to the U.S. as well," a company executive told Reuters, declining to give detailed targets.

The Hong Kong-listed SUV and pickup maker had picked an Italian trading firm last December as its local partner.

The Hover SUV, which sells for roughly 100,000 yuan ($12,597) in China, was priced at $20,000 in Italy, the executive said.



The company was also looking at other developed markets in Europe such as Spain and Greece, he added.

Great Wall sells to more than 50 countries spanning Africa, the Middle East, South America and Russia.

Exports came to 18,000 units in 2005, accounting for a quarter of its overall sales. The ratio could increase to 35 percent this year and to 50 percent by 2008, a company executive told Reuters earlier. ($1=7.9385 Yuan)

http://today.reuters.com/news/articleinvesting.aspx?view=CN&storyID=2006-09-05T025520Z_01_SHA55624_RTRIDST_0_AUTOS-CHINA-GREATWALL.XML&rpc=66&type=qcna

If BMW can drive into China, why can't the Great Wall of China move to Europe? That's exactly why the Chinese motor company displayed its Hover SUV and Wingle pick up at the Paris Motor show. And like its namesake, this one too attracted viewers by the dozens. If the curiosity translates into buying interest Great Wall will be here by 2008.



Supervisor - Intl Division, Great Wall Motor, Jie Zhu said, "The European market is mature and developed. We are at the Motor Show to understand more of the market."



But another Chinese company already has the first mover advantage. Landwind launched in Europe with an SUV but hit a speed breaker when its first vehicle failed to clear a mandatory crash test. The image was dented but the spirit was not.



Landwind's hoping a safer SUV at a 25% discount to competition will jumpstart sales. Add to that Fashion and the sales target is 10,000 units by 2008.

Distributor, Landwind, Peter Bijvelds, 'Our products will offer best quality price ratio.'



But when the price is rock bottom how good could the quality be? That's a big concern in a market known for it's excellent engineering and competitiveness. And a negative perception of China could be a positive for India.



President-Auto Sector, M&M, Pawan Goenka said, 'There's a general perception, don't know if it's true, that Indian brands are better.'



Also Indian brands offer a cheaper, diesel version as well. Nonetheless, Western Europe is a tough nut to crack for both and analysts say Asian carmakers should focus on Eastern Europe where there's more growth.

source: moneycontrol.com

it's stupid...beacuse of landwind fiasko at crash test...many other chinese company now have problems....all of them are in "bad voice"..they are unsafe...bad quality and so...but compare landwind and gwm??? gwm is 10 times bigger than landwind...more suvs,pick up...and so....they are better company than a landwind...bit it's isn't matter...the only thing which will attract the buyers is the price! i think that hover and safe models from gwm are better from landwind...also landwind must have new crash test...and i hope that it will be better than a first time

micodelija, glad to see you here. I've just found this site and decided to join.

Some words on the subject: as far as I know, Russian dealer "Irito" held a crashtest of GW SAFE and its result was rather good. It was a year ago.

yes..gwm safe also passed the crash test,you have the pictures somewhere here...glad to see you here,it's hard for me to talk on russian forum...because translation program don't translate ok,this forum is for all gwm fans thru the world...it's ok...we can share our expiriences with GWM

What rating did the GWM Safe get ?

What type of safety testing do the Russian Automotive Industry ? do they copy the EuroNCAP or NHTSA in testing ?

yes..gwm safe also passed the crash test,you have the pictures somewhere here...glad to see you here,it's hard for me to talk on russian forum...because translation program don't translate ok,this forum is for all gwm fans thru the world...it's ok...we can share our expiriences with GWM

About crash test: source is greatwall.ru/news.php?id=171 for example, and it tells that Russian dealer "Irito" ask the manufacturer to hold crash test of SUV G5 (i.e. SAFE). Test was at China testing polygon. Test was held according to European Rule num.94 (I dont'n know how it should be in English) - it's as EuroNCAP except speed: 56 km/h instead of 64 km/h.
They didn't tell exact details, only told that SAFE passed this test successfully. And there is a photo.

P. S. Sorry, I'm not allowed to insert a hyperlink, because it's only my second post at this forum :)

What type of safety testing do the Russian Automotive Industry ? do they copy the EuroNCAP or NHTSA in testing ?

I don't remember demands of safety testing for imported cars. But I certainly know that there is NO NEED of crash test for passenger car made in Russia!

there is no law by which manifatures of automobiles must give their vehicles on crash test...this is the law in europe

Italian dealer of GWM cars introduced special version of Hover, called Sport with some cosmetic changes on exterior and l interior.

In my oppinon the car looks much better.

http://www.blogsmithmedia.com/es.autoblog.com/media/2007/03/hover_sport1.jpg
http://www.blogsmithmedia.com/es.autoblog.com/media/2007/03/hover_sport8.jpg
http://www.blogsmithmedia.com/es.autoblog.com/media/2007/03/hover_sport3.jpg
http://www.blogsmithmedia.com/es.autoblog.com/media/2007/03/hover_sport6.jpg

Yeah the cosmetic touches are nice! Italians sure have a flair for design - I'm sure they had some input here.

27 March, 2007
Source: Automotive World
SUV specialist Great Wall Motor, based in Baoding in Hebei province, has entered into an export agreement with Romania's Alexandrion Group, XFN-Asia has reported. According to the OEM, Alexandrion has projected annual sales of 10,000 Great Wall cars

BEIJING (XFN-ASIA) - Great Wall Motor Co Ltd, China's largest sport utility vehicle (SUV) maker, said it has signed an export agreement with Romania's Alexandrion Group.

Great Wall said in a statement that Alexandrion projects annual sales of 10,000 Great Wall vehicles by 2010.

Great Wall's 2006 sales totaled 40,062 units, up 41 pct, and accounting for 17.5 pct of China SUV sales.

From Automotive New Europe:

Italian dealer wants more Chinese SUVs

"IFAS Group sells Great Wall vehicles in north-west Italy. In the first six months of this year, IFAS Group sold 25 units of the Great Wall Hover, group CEO Nicola Loccisano said. "But probably we could have done twice as many if we had enough vehicles."

The retailer's success with Great Wall is a bright spot for Chinese automakers, which are off to a slow start in Europe. Loccisano said a shipment of 201 Hovers left China in June. The cars are headed to Italian distributor Eurasia Motors. Loccisano said he needs at least 250 sales a year for Great Wall to support a seperate showroom. IFAS has also talked with other Chinese automakers. Loccisano said he turned down Brilliance because "in Italy, there is no market for large, three-box sedans with only a gasoline engine. Clients just buy diesel wagons. He is still talking with Chery Automobile. Loccisano said he likes Chery's future lineup, but said the automaker hasn't settled on its plans for Europe."

Great Wall registrations in Italy:

2006:

Hover: 33
Wingle: 2
total: 35 cars

2007 (Jan-May):

Hover: 172
Wingle: 2
total: 174 cars

Great Wall Hover was the first Chinese car I saw driving on the road. This happened in 15th of July, 2007 on a road leading from Rimini to Florence in Italy. It was a dealer car with big 'Great Wall' signs on both sides.

I recently had to use a GWM in Namibia.

Safety is not related to the size of the manufacturer.

Nor only to crash test result.

By the way, Russian crash test result might appear are very suspicious...

Just open the tail gate of the car. It's so badly designed that I had it at the heigt of my nose. This is designed for very small people.
For Europeans, you risk to injure yourself if you don't pay a lot of attention.

Go inside and try to find the fire extinguisher.
If you manage to find it under the driver seat, you will have to struggle to take it out, having advanced the seat to the maximum. Really what you are thinking of in case of fire. And then, you get such a microscopic extinguisher that you can really wonder if it would be of any use.

Climb inside and grab the steering wheel. Well, since it was a right hand drive car, I would have been happy to be able to see the position of the controls (lamps, indicators, wippers). Not easy since they are printed on the wrond side of the knobs... So I had to use them blindly.

And guess what ? The specification seems to be wrong. I can say that the tank would not accept more than 50 liters of petrol. Too small and this nearly ended as out of fuel in the middle of the bush.

These were the little safety related points out of all the wrong things I had to observe ...

I don't like going offtopic and bash any other country here but I don't think that general perception of indian brands are better is true at all, if you just look at the crash test of the electric car Reva aka G-wiz.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=NGjvt8tqRYc
http://youtube.com/watch?v=btw3DaqJbpI&mode=related&search=

I am really sorry if this post offends any members here but I just would like to point out about that general perception. I mean if the electric car look like this then I don't think how a conventional car will look like

ok get back to the topic, I don't really know if GWM can really make it to Europe, I think they will need more time and really put their mind into it in order to achieve it , hopefull they learnt the lessons from Landwind and do a much better job than Landwind. Great Wall landing in Italy is already a good sign but let us not be too optimistic about this and hope Great Wall can really make a good example for other Chinese carmakers to follow up

Thanks for reading

Great Wall is already in Europe they have mora than 90 dealers in Italy.

micodelija, glad to see you here. I've just found this site and decided to join.

Some words on the subject: as far as I know, Russian dealer "Irito" held a crashtest of GW SAFE and its result was rather good. It was a year ago.

cool an othere english speaking GW driver in russia,

Yaroslavl
D5 2x4

From AutoNewsEurope:

CHINESE BRAND WILL LAUNCH PERI DESPITE FIAT'S CLAIMS CAR IS A COPY OF THE PANDA

Great Wall Motor plans to sell its Peri minicar and Cowry minivan in Europe starting next year. Great Wall Chairman Wei Jianjun said the carmaker expects to obtain EU type approval for the models in December. He was speaking at an event here to launch a new 200,000-unit-a-year production line for the models. Weng Fengying, Great Wall's president said: "We will launch the whole range of our products in Europe in the second half of 2008."

Fiat is taking legal action against Great Wall over the Peri. Fiat saysinfringes its design copyright because it colesly resembles its Panda, the best-selling minicar in Europe. The Italian automaker says that only the headlights and the bumpers on the Peri are different from the Panda's. Great Wall executives say Fiat's legal action will not stop the launch of the company's first minicar. Wang said it is not unusual for cars from different makers to have similarities. "We are confident we will win in the courts and in the marketplace with the Peri", Wang said.


DEALERS ARE READY

Based about 130km from Beijing, Great Wall is one of the largest producers of pickups and SUV's in China. Its Hover SUV is sold in Italy and Romania. Wang said delaers in other European countries such as the UK, Greece, Portugal and the Netherlands are getting ready to sell Great Wall vehicles. Andrew Edminston, managing director of UK's IM Group, said he expects to sell Great Wall models in the UK within two years. IM Group is working with Great Wall to help it meet EU regulations for passenger cars, Edminston said. IM Group sells Subaru, Daihatsu and Isuzu cars in the UK.

The addition of the minicar assembly line doubles production capacity at the Baoding factory to 400,000 units a year. By 2010, the automaker plans to build 500,000 vehicles a year and export about half of them. Great Wall says it will open a new engine plant next year next to its car-making complex. The plant will have capacity to build 400,000 gasoline, diesel and hybrid powertrains a year. The engines will be between 800cc and 2,0 liters. Currently, Great Wall builds 2,2- and 2,8 -liter gasoline engines for its SUVs and pickups in a plant capable of 200,000 units annually.


COOL BEAR IS COMING

The Peri and Cowry go on sale in China starting in December. The Peri, known as the Gwperi in China, will cost between 43,000 yuan (about €4,000) and 53,000 yuan (€4,930). The seven-seat Cowry will cost 116,000 yuan (about €10,790). The Chinese government gave Great Wall a license to compete in the passenger-car segment on October 24. The automaker plans to launch more new cars including the Florid five-door sedan, Cool Bear minivan and i7 small hatchback.

Oh no, the Peri :nono: :(

According to omniauto.it court in Italian city of Turin judged that Great Wall has to pay a fine of 15.000 EUR for every single Peri imported to Italy! It also banned any sort of advertisement of that car.
Reason is of course to obvious resemblance to Fiat Panda.

http://www.omniauto.it/magazine/5799/multati-i-cloni-cinesi-della-fiat-panda

This for sure will teach Great Wall a hard lesson.

ok, let's go step by step...there is two courts in progress, one in italy and one in china, i have info from the first hand and fiat many time delay that court...so i think that this information is false, one court which was in great britan where is car homolgated...is done, and they refuse the law suit from fiat(i read that somewhere but i can't confirm but car is over 90% homolgated in britan), also there is another thing..italian law will sure get the desicion on fiat...and chinese...of course on GWM, so i am quite wondering how will this happen...no matter...i already plan to order some peri models, i like it

also peri is still in homolgation progress...most of it are done...but there is still plenty of work to do on some small matters, second model which will hit the market in europe is STEED(wingle)model

i am sure that GWM wount pay a dime for it and there is always possibility to change something in the car before entering market in european union

It would be very nice if you can just try to dig out some sources and links for everything above :)

Thanks for the info Mico


PS : if the homologation progress was done in the U.K then what are the chances of it going on sale in the UK ?

From Automotive News.

Great Wall banned from exporting GWPeri minicar.

A Turin court ruled this week that a Chinese minicar built by independent automaker Great Wall won't be allowed into Europe.

The court said the GWPeri minicar is too similar to the Fiat Panda.

Fiat sued Great Wall both in Italy and in China. Those moves were aimed at keeping the GWPeri out of the European Union and out of China. Fiat alleged that the car was a clone of its Panda minicar.

On July 16, a Turin court accepted Fiat's claims, saying in its ruling "the (GWPeri) doesn't look like a different car but is a (Fiat) Panda with a different front end."

The court ruled that Great Wall should pay a 15,000-euro fine for the first GWPeri imported in Europe. In case of further violations of the ruling, the fine grows to 50,000 euros per imported car.

Lawyers for Great Wall said the company will appeal the Turin court decision.

The court case in China is still pending. Earlier this year, Great Wall starting selling the GWPeri in China.

Fiat doesn't sell the Panda in China. The car has been Europe's best selling minicar since 2004.

won't be allowed into Europe and won't be allowed into Italy is two different things so which is is the verdict ?

It would be very nice if you can just try to dig out some sources and links for everything above :)

Thanks for the info Mico


PS : if the homologation progress was done in the U.K then what are the chances of it going on sale in the UK ?

you see now what they say..now is already 50000 euros, soon will be that fiat will buy gwm because they want to stop producing of peri....i can't belive what the press are doing, peri is already exported in many countries...near europe it's ukraine,turkey,russia, is african countries it's alredy exported over 5000 vehicles...they can's stop the selling of PERI because of one stuff which i hear that must be...it say, car must be 75% smillar to other product so you can call it a copy...peri is not....end of story :D

first car which will hit the market in U.K is steed (wingle), he is already prepared with sterring wheel on right side, engine will be 2.4 mivec mitsubishi gasoline engine

Thanks Mico :D

when is the wingle scheduled to enter the UK?

Never, because the Great Wall Wingle is a copy of the Isuzu D-MAX/Rodeo ;)

when is the wingle scheduled to enter the UK?

still I don't know the 100% sure date, but can be very very soon :)

to DAEWOO...if you follow the products of gwm...most of those cars are based on isuzu, hover is also based on isuzu axiom, gwm for long year have coperration between isuzu and them, even this engine 2.8 TC diesel is based on isuzu tehonology, by outside elements steed/wingle don't have any part which is smillar to d-max model, interior is the same like they did from axiom model in hover, that interior was in d-max in 2005-2006 year model, in 2007 isuzu change it and gwm buys that old interior..now install it on also in sailor model,alo the homolgated engine for european market is mitsubishi mivec 24 gasoline while isuzu most of it offer is based on diesel engines 2.5 and 3-0

many chinese cars after that install it also,some models of zx auto, landwind...bla bla bla

Well as far as the Peri goes,
I just shipped 4 units to West Africa, and none at g.w.m. put any objection or mentioned anything about export dificulties

Great Wall Motor to appeal vs ruling on Europe ban.

July 22, 2008 - China's Great Wall Motor Co will appeal against a Turin court's ruling to ban it from selling a compact car in the European Union because it too closely resembles Fiat's FIA.M Panda, a lawyer for the Chinese company said on Monday.

"There is no doubt that we will appeal against the ruling," he said, although he added that the company was still working on its response to last week's decision.

The Turin court ruled that Great Wall should pay a 15,000 euro ($23,810) fine for the first compact GWPeri imported into Europe, while further violations would carry fines of 50,000 euros per imported car, Automotive News reported over the weekend.

"We cannot accept the ruling. Let me reiterate that GWPeri was developed on our own and has no similarity to the Panda," said Great Wall spokesman Shang Yugui.

He added that a suit filed by Fiat in China was still awaiting a decision.

Last October, a Fiat spokeswoman in China said the Italian firm had started legal proceedings against Great Wall in China and in Europe over the similarity of the GWPeri and the Panda.

Great Wall, China's largest sport utility vehicle maker, started selling the GWPeri in mid-March in China priced at 43,900 yuan to 55,800 yuan ($6,430 - $8,173).

The company has sold around 4,000 of the vehicles, which are also available in the Middle East, South America and Russia, Shang said.

Great Wall's Hong Kong-listed shares rose 2.57 percent on Monday to HK$5.59, in line with a 2.76 percent rise in Hong Kong's China Enterprises Index.

From:Reuters

Great Wall Motor appeals against Fiat ruling

July 25, 2008

Shanghai, July 25 (Gasgoo.com) Chinese carmaker Great Wall Motor Co has already issued an appeal against an Italian court ruling that bars it from selling a compact car in the European Union because it too closely resembles Fiat's Panda, a Great Wall official told Chinese media on Thursday.

"We are expecting a just and reasonable judgment this time," Great Wall spokesman Shang Yugui told Shanghai Securities Journal. He said it's incomprehensible that the Turin court ruling starkly contradicts car experts' conclusion.

Shang explained that the Turin court had hired a group of car experts to investigate into the case in advance, and the experts concluded that Great Wall's Peri has its own feature and doesn't violate the property rights of Fiat's Panda. The Turin court, however, ruled on July 16 that "the Peri is a (Fiat) Panda with a different front end."

The court decided that Great Wall should pay a 15,000 euro ($23,810) fine for the first compact Peri imported into Europe, Automotive News Europe said, but Great Wall is allowed to appeal against the ruling within 15 days.

The Chinese automaker claims the Italian court may simply want to protect the auto corporations of its own country as Great Wall's competitive car Peri on sale in the EU market will pose a serious challenge to the Italian brand.

Great Wall said in a statement issued today that it did not anticipate the dispute on the mainland to have any immediate material adverse effects on its operations, business or financial position, but its EU export plan might be affected.

http://www.gasgoo.com/auto-news/7192/Great-Wall-Motor-appeals-against-Fiat-ruling.html

Great Wall Wingle gets EU’s green light for export
By Kelly From:Gasgoo.comJuly 28, 2008
Shanghai, July 28 (Gasgoo.com) Chinese carmaker Great Wall Motor announced the company has been approved to export its high-end pickup Wingle to the European market, reported xinhua.net today.

According to test results released by the British Vehicle Certification Agency (VCA), the Wingle model has passed 26 tests in safety, emission, noise and other aspects. Thus VCA confirmed that Great Wall’s Wingle has met European standards.

Wingle, the main export products of Great Wall Motor, has been sold in more than 70 countries except the European Union. Now, the Chinese carmaker is delivering this model to the European market, starting from Italy, Romania and other countries with the Great Wall overseas sales channel.

Great Wall's sights are now set on Europe. As a launch model for Europe, the Wingle has been produced to meet the European standards. "Wingle is a pickup that can rival Ford and Toyota, so undoubtedly the model can get European’s approval," said the overseas marketing department of Great Wall.

this I can say that is a old news :) i already got his information 3 week ago when progress was done,hehe,also i have all documentation from VCA, i can't wait to order it...name for europe will be STEED like it's sold in south africa,mass production of that model will be very soon, i hope that i will be able to order it maybe for one month

personaly wingle is a good car...but i will like it more when i drive it with gasoline engine...136 HP!!!! + LPG on it :) :) :) that rulessss

Micodelija

Does it also include the Euro Ncap test ?

by the homolgation progress car must pass regular ECE R94 and R95 regulation, i have those test reports and i can tell you for sure that car is safe, for homolgation progress you don't must to give the vehicle to euroncap institute, my car how have over 25000 km and car is very good, for now i didn't have any accident and big problems with it

personaly i would like that gwm put the steed at ncap test to compare that results with other car makers

here i find a note from chinese stock exchange
http://img504.imageshack.us/img504/4947/65797795ys2.jpg

chinese court dismiss law suit from fiat

http://img362.imageshack.us/img362/4690/peri210x140pc1.jpg
and here is a result, picture of expert which made a 3d comparation between panda and peri, orange color is what look like panda...not more that 5% of it

Let's start discussion about Peri on this forum also.

What do you think? Should Peri be banned from European market because of its similarity with Fiat Panda? Was the decision of Italian court just or unfair?
For the beginning I will sustain from my oppinion until I hear yours. Anyway Testdriver knows it :p

Hello Micodeljia, this picture is used by Fiat in her Turin case against Great Wall.
The whole case is amazing: Fiat == Great Wall, Turin == Shijiazhuang, Italy (Europe) == China?
Even the comment on this picture is reversed to your opinion:
"This computer-enhanced photo of the Great Wall Peri shows in orange what sources say are the only design differences between the Peri and the Fiat Panda."
See: http://www.autonews.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080718/COPY01/829890072/-1/chicgo&template=printart

I am very sorry to say so, because I like their enthousiasm (and a lot of Chinese friends think the same about this ..) but Great Wall (like BYD) is a bloody copier.
Examples:
Great Wall Hover: body inspired by Isuzu Aixom.
Great Wall Wingle: front end copied from Volkswagen Magellan.
Great Wall Peri: body copied from Fiat Panda.
Great Wall Florid: body copied from Toyota/ Scion xA.
Great Wall Phenom (I7): body based on Toyota Yaris.
Great Wall Feelfine (CH051): body based on Toyota Rectis/Corolla Verso.
Great Wall Coolbear; body inspired by Toyota/Scion xB.
Great Wall Cowry (V08): body inspired by Toyota Noah.
And when I say "inspired" I am very friendly.
I haven't talked about the platforms of of the cars, but I think they are copied from the Toyota Yaris.
Greetings,

Sorry, I am not very clear, but I mean to say, that my Chinese design friends think too that Great Wall is a bloody copier.

But Byd goes even further in copying, by using Toyota's press documents for its own press documents!

woot !!

what you mean, please explain. thanks.

I don't know what Jonathan means. But I know that BYD showed at the Beijing Show photos of their new S3 SUV. It came out that the photos (in official BYD publications) are stolen photos from the new Toyota RAV4.
Here the thumbnails, left the BYD and right the Toyota.

Hello Micodeljia, this picture is used by Fiat in her Turin case against Great Wall.
The whole case is amazing: Fiat == Great Wall, Turin == Shijiazhuang, Italy (Europe) == China?
Even the comment on this picture is reversed to your opinion:
"This computer-enhanced photo of the Great Wall Peri shows in orange what sources say are the only design differences between the Peri and the Fiat Panda."
See: http://www.autonews.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080718/COPY01/829890072/-1/chicgo&template=printart

I am very sorry to say so, because I like their enthousiasm (and a lot of Chinese friends think the same about this ..) but Great Wall (like BYD) is a bloody copier.
Examples:
Great Wall Hover: body inspired by Isuzu Aixom.
Great Wall Wingle: front end copied from Volkswagen Magellan.
Great Wall Peri: body copied from Fiat Panda.
Great Wall Florid: body copied from Toyota/ Scion xA.
Great Wall Phenom (I7): body based on Toyota Yaris.
Great Wall Feelfine (CH051): body based on Toyota Rectis/Corolla Verso.
Great Wall Coolbear; body inspired by Toyota/Scion xB.
Great Wall Cowry (V08): body inspired by Toyota Noah.
And when I say "inspired" I am very friendly.
I haven't talked about the platforms of of the cars, but I think they are copied from the Toyota Yaris.
Greetings,

ok...let's go step by step, i am informed that gwm had somekind of cooperation between them and fiat,and somewhere that failed, now is very difficult to discuss about it but here is what it is

great wall cooperation with toyota, long time gwm did a joint venture jobs for toyota, even some parts are equal to toyota parts, and od some car's there was parts with orginal toyota logo on it,also great wall buy whole production line of toyota and then the models like deer(toyota hilux 2001 model) and safe (old toyota 4 runner) was produced, also with that GW 1.3 EFI engine produced by great wall toyota give their tehnology to them,long time gwm buys some old models of toyota,the same is like mitsubishi engine, gwm always have older versions of engines, we can all wonder how that coolbear, florid and other models was made

great wall with isuzu, great wall long time work with isuzu, especcialy because of engines, 4JB1 ISUZU, GW4D28 ENGINE...and all newer diesel engines from gwm are based on isuzu, also gwm buy a licence from isuzu for axiom model, because that model have very bad selling results in american market...and still it was quite useful, italians torino design did a whole new mask of hover...so you can't say that hovere is a copy of isuzu, becase gwm legal buy that,the same situation is for wingle....wingle is a vehicle completly based on isuzu-dmax model, interior is the same like from old model od d-max, also that rear bumper and chasis, as i know volkswagen used that concept for their newer cars in group like audi q7 etc, ant that car was never in production

in this modern time it's always easier way to outbuy some older model and do a restyiling if is possible, especcially this is popular in china, many other european brands there still selling their older models...like jetta, peugeot 206, citroen bx bla bla bla, so i hope that in future they will start to produce models which is orginal, this will be also very difficult because in R&D department of gwm there is many workers from europe, japan etc..

So did GWM buy the license for Dmax from Isuzu ?

Hello Micodelija,

I agree with your conclusion "i hope that in future they will start to produce models which are orginal", I am happy our dispute brings us to the same conclusion.
Still I don't agree with a number of things you are telling. It would be nice if you have any proof to show me that I am wrong.

Fiat-Great Wall: there has never been any cooperation between Fiat and Great Wall. I wonder if it is someone from Great Wall who tells you this?

Toyota-Great Wall: Great Wall never worked for Toyota. The fact that Great Wall has at sometime used original Toyota parts doesn't prove anything: Chery used VW parts for their Fengyun (Toledo) chassis, VW complained about this at SAIC, at that time partner in Chery, and SAIC decided to drop out Chery. And than Chery was blocked by Chinese court to use any VW parts. And note this wonderful Landcruiser story, at picture 4 you can see the logo of the Huaxiang Fuqi, which in fact the car is. http://free.21cn.com/forum/bbsMessageList.act?currentPage=1&bbsThreadId=1569609.
No, like so many Chinese SUV companies (maybe more than 10) Great Wall just uses the Toyota models as their great example, without any approval.
Their small, new Toyota copies like Coolbear and Florid are designed by TJ Innova in Shanghai. In 2006 at the Beijing show the TJ Innova booth was near the Great Wall booth, I asked the TJ Innova general manager how he could explain me the fact that TJ Innova copied all these Toyota models, and he replied that China has a right to copy foreign models as long as China is backward to these countries. So TJ Innova thinks it has a right to steal till China is fully developed. They told me nothing about any agreement with Toyota.

The stories about the Hover and the Wingle are also not true, there is not any relationship or agreement between Great Wall and Isuzu. I wonder who does you believe this, can you give me any proof. Again, I can imagine people at Great Wall can say things like this, just to defend or justify themselves.

I agree cars nowadays are look-a-likes, (they were that already in the 1920s!!), but still there are companies, also in China, who make interesting new models which are not bloody copies, for instance like Brilliance.

Micodelija, I hope you can give some proof (I really hope I am wrong) but unless that, I will remain to my ideas.

OMG what kind of mentality is this ? China will be forever backward with these type of people.

At least Brilliance is doing some works with the FRV.

TJ Innova and GWM can rot in hell if they carry on with this attitude.

TJ Innova is the same people that design the Lifan Passat, correct ?

The funny thing is when you try to enter TJ Innova site, it says "the page cannot be found"

lol what kind of company is that.

And look at this , their concept

http://response.jp/issue/2005/0421/article70092_1.images/85645.jpg

http://response.jp/issue/2005/0421/article70092_1.images/85644.jpg

people say it is the copy of Renault Fluence concept

http://www.allsportauto.com/photoautre/renault/fluence/2004_renault_fluence_10_m.jpg

http://www.allsportauto.com/photoautre/renault/fluence/2004_renault_fluence_09_m.jpg

Hello Micodelija,

I agree with your conclusion "i hope that in future they will start to produce models which are orginal", I am happy our dispute brings us to the same conclusion.
Still I don't agree with a number of things you are telling. It would be nice if you have any proof to show me that I am wrong.

Fiat-Great Wall: there has never been any cooperation between Fiat and Great Wall. I wonder if it is someone from Great Wall who tells you this?

Toyota-Great Wall: Great Wall never worked for Toyota. The fact that Great Wall has at sometime used original Toyota parts doesn't prove anything: Chery used VW parts for their Fengyun (Toledo) chassis, VW complained about this at SAIC, at that time partner in Chery, and SAIC decided to drop out Chery. And than Chery was blocked by Chinese court to use any VW parts. And note this wonderful Landcruiser story, at picture 4 you can see the logo of the Huaxiang Fuqi, which in fact the car is. http://free.21cn.com/forum/bbsMessageList.act?currentPage=1&bbsThreadId=1569609.
No, like so many Chinese SUV companies (maybe more than 10) Great Wall just uses the Toyota models as their great example, without any approval.
Their small, new Toyota copies like Coolbear and Florid are designed by TJ Innova in Shanghai. In 2006 at the Beijing show the TJ Innova booth was near the Great Wall booth, I asked the TJ Innova general manager how he could explain me the fact that TJ Innova copied all these Toyota models, and he replied that China has a right to copy foreign models as long as China is backward to these countries. So TJ Innova thinks it has a right to steal till China is fully developed. They told me nothing about any agreement with Toyota.

The stories about the Hover and the Wingle are also not true, there is not any relationship or agreement between Great Wall and Isuzu. I wonder who does you believe this, can you give me any proof. Again, I can imagine people at Great Wall can say things like this, just to defend or justify themselves.

I agree cars nowadays are look-a-likes, (they were that already in the 1920s!!), but still there are companies, also in China, who make interesting new models which are not bloody copies, for instance like Brilliance.

Micodelija, I hope you can give some proof (I really hope I am wrong) but unless that, I will remain to my ideas.

you have intresting opinion...but here is my, i don't know why you always look for some kind of proff? does small people who want to buy cheap car and have cheap expences for it care about it? i am not a lawyer to bother with things like this...and personaly i really don't care about it :) until all of my cars works ok

first models of great wall, deer, safe...i saw in that company whole production line, on some of them there is still toyota logo on it,i am sure that nobody put the stickers of toyota logo's on it, so by my opinion gwm must contact them and outbuy that production line, so you can't say that gwm don't have any cooperation with toyota, i am not in top managment of great wall to know what they do, but by this what i see it was my conclusion

same is with isuzu, some vehicles from great wall have original engine of isuzu on it, that 4JB1 enigne, with isuzu logo on it,so this means that company cooperate with them....now gwm produce that engine by their own, called 4D28 engine, same is with that mitsubishi engine in hover 4G64..i saw in company the same engine with great wall logo on it and it's called GW2.4S engine

for fiat i know that fiat try to find a partner for chinese market because there they have very bad selling results, i hear that they already change couple of partners which produce vehicles from them, we can all wonder how peri was designed...by my opinion i think that some europeans which work in gwm...used this idea and finalized it, the same story was in cherry when daewoo enginerrs was sacked and lost job, they find a job in china and bring there all documentation for procudtion of daewoo matiz model,just sold it there like cherry qq model

TJ Innova also allegedly copied the Citroën ZX for Shanghai Maple and Lifan. I'm not allowed to post links because I'm below 10 posts :( but googling "bootleg Citroëns" will get you there.

(Erik knows this already, of course, since the Citroënet site thanks him for information, but it's worth pointing out that TJ Innova have 'form' for this kind of behaviour.)

Mico.

Do you think GWM is present in Georgia ? coz I saw a footage and it keeps on puzzling me if those police pickups are GW.

can be, gwm export vehicles there

Mico.

Do you think GWM is present in Georgia ? coz I saw a footage and it keeps on puzzling me if those police pickups are GW.

Exactly i had the same feeling.
I remember seeing on tv a road block of this georgean police suv that was crashed by a russian tank.
This is tougher than ncap crash test!

September 19, 2008 - A Turin appeals court last week made the final ruling that prevents a minicar GWPeri, manufactured by China's Great Wall Motor, from being imported into Europe, Fiat China company said to Nanfang Daily yesterday.

A local court in Turin said in its ruling on 16 July, "the Gwperi does not look like a different car but is a Fiat Panda with a different front end." The court has ruled that the vehicle will not be allowed into Europe and also ordered Great Wall Motor to pay 15,000 euros (US$23,553) in penalty.

Another 50,000 euros will be charged on each model if the company continues to bring the car to Europe. Great Wall Motor appealed against the ruling immediately. In the final ruling, the Turin appeals court also upheld fines issued against Great Wall in July by the lower court.

"Gwperi is never expected to be introduced to Europe," Great Wall Motor spokesman Shang Yugui said. Earlier, he was quoted many times as saying that Turin's ruling is unfair and its only aim is to protect Italy's own auto industry, as they are afraid the launch of Great Wall Gwperi may hurt the sales of Fiat Panda."

The ruling will not affect Gwperi exports to other countries, Shang added.

From:Gasgoo.com

http://img201.imageshack.us/img201/7725/pc064425ld8.jpg

http://img367.imageshack.us/img367/5729/pc064431aj7.jpg

http://img367.imageshack.us/img367/2787/pc064442oy1.jpg

http://img156.imageshack.us/img156/3387/pc064447um5.jpg

we have opened a new showroom in bosnia, there was hover gasoline and diesel, also there was a deer and wingle pick up

Wishing you all the best of luck Micodelija. You are one of Great Wall's best spokesman and persuasive salesman, and I'm sure you will enjoy success.

thank you my friend on your nice wishes :) i also hope that buisness will go very well, especially when we got new vehicles from passenger car segment :thumb:, on the opening was 2 televisons, 10 press medians, local politicians,managers of big companies, president of the county and chinese ammbasador :)

i also expect that opening will be very soon also on great wall official website

wow .. it´s very interesting ... do you have euro 4 engines ???

very soon we will have new hover and wingle pick up with euro 4 engines, this in showroom are old models which are all euro 3 but have OBD sistem, also most of them we usually sold with LPG, so you don't must to pay a taxes for emmison

also new coming passenger cars are all euro 4, like peri, florid, coolbear, cowry

it is good news for this cars ... i hope it will be for sale in other europe countries in near future :-)

Great Wall Motor breaks ground for Bulgaria plant.

May 13, 2009 (Gasgoo.com) - China's largest sport utility vehicle (SUV) maker, Great Wall Motor Co, has started construction of an auto plant in Lovech city of Bulgaria in cooperation with Bulgaria's Litex, Bulgarian media reported on May 11th.

The plant has an initial investment of 80 million euros and is expected to produce Great Wall's Florid cars and Hover SUVs. According to Sofia News Agency, this project will initially create 1,000 new jobs.

Bulgaria's Prime Minster, Sergey Stanishev, broke ground for the plant during the opening ceremony.

Mr. Stanishev said that the plant was a symbol of his Cabinet's policy to make the country attractive for foreign investments and to create new, competitive productions.

http://autonews.gasgoo.com/resource/editor/photo_verybig_103503.jpg
Bulgaria's Prime Minster, Sergey Stanishev, broke ground of the Great Wall car factory near the city of Lovetch

1426Sono mesi che seguo il VS. forum e mi piace molto.
Allego mie foto dello STEED che guido in Italia.:cool:

http://www.greatwall.it/ .. but only two models ... deer or safe arn´t for sale in italy :(

Production of Safe is nearly zero this year: First 6 months 2009:
Hover 26.804; Safe 89; Sing 0.
I have no pickup figures.

1426Sono mesi che seguo il VS. forum e mi piace molto.
Allego mie foto dello STEED che guido in Italia.:cool:

è questo il tuo pick up?
is this your pick up? this wingle look very nice, especially with that hard top on it

Production of Safe is nearly zero this year: First 6 months 2009:
Hover 26.804; Safe 89; Sing 0.
I have no pickup figures.

where you get this information? is it public?
by my opinion it's good that GWM stop the production of those older models, simply now in 2009 year i think that they don't need to produce those models, maybe it will be better for them to produce new and more modern suv's like hover is

as i know safe is still popular on markets like russia, sing is selling in south africa as multiwagon model, and deer pick up have many production lines in africa and some contries near vietnam or indonesia, also wingle is having good selling results, they just enter australian market and in last month wingle was best selling pick up in italy,over 150 units was sold

Micodelija: these numbers are the official CAAM figures, sold by the Chinese authorities. They don't register pickups seperately, they are registered as small trucks together with 'ordinary' small fc trucks.

Great Wall Motor breaks ground for Bulgaria plant.

May 13, 2009 (Gasgoo.com) - China's largest sport utility vehicle (SUV) maker, Great Wall Motor Co, has started construction of an auto plant in Lovech city of Bulgaria in cooperation with Bulgaria's Litex, Bulgarian media reported on May 11th.

The plant has an initial investment of 80 million euros and is expected to produce Great Wall's Florid cars and Hover SUVs. According to Sofia News Agency, this project will initially create 1,000 new jobs.

Bulgaria's Prime Minster, Sergey Stanishev, broke ground for the plant during the opening ceremony.

Mr. Stanishev said that the plant was a symbol of his Cabinet's policy to make the country attractive for foreign investments and to create new, competitive productions.

Bulgaria's Prime Minster, Sergey Stanishev, broke ground of the Great Wall car factory near the city of Lovetch
Yes actually we think of making a new Bulgarian brand called "Litex Motors Corporation" (or LMC).They are supposed compeat with the loccal cheap Romanian (Dacia;Aro) and Turkish (Samand..and other) cars.One of them is going to worth 8000 BGN here in Bulgaria wich is around 4000 Euro:eek: In the auto blant we are going to make GWM Hover and i think the GMM Deer or something like that.The constuction is supposed to end at 2011.:thumb:

Sorry for the bad english ,but i'm still learning:nod:

After writing: Dacia Logan (sedan car) -14 000 BGN~7000 euro
Samand "?" (sedan car)-15 000 BGN (15 500- "+" version)~8000 euro
Aro "?" [real hardcore jeep not a SUV (something like TATA SUMO) ]-around 15-16 000 leva ~9000 euro

Great Wall Hover L caught during my visit to Gorizia, Italy:

http://s2.mojalbum.com/kitajci-32-foto_4219952_17409091_18222840.jpg
http://s2.mojalbum.com/kitajci-32-foto_4219952_17409091_18222839.jpg
http://s2.mojalbum.com/kitajci-32-foto_4219952_17409091_18222837.jpg


I have already seen Chinese cars in Italy (GW Hover and Wingle) before, but this was the first time I manage to take picture of one.

Great Wall Hover L caught during my visit to Gorizia, Italy:

http://s2.mojalbum.com/kitajci-32-foto_4219952_17409091_18222840.jpg
http://s2.mojalbum.com/kitajci-32-foto_4219952_17409091_18222839.jpg
http://s2.mojalbum.com/kitajci-32-foto_4219952_17409091_18222837.jpg


I have already seen Chinese cars in Italy (GW Hover and Wingle) before, but this was the first time I managed to take picture of one.

http://img256.imageshack.us/img256/9436/cuvx.jpg
hi martin, here is one from slovenia as well :)

Great Wall´s Czech web sites http://www.gwmotor.cz/ ...

hm...intresting, today i send an email to great wall about this company, they never hear for it and never sign any contract with it :rolleyes:

maybe it isn´t official dealer , but independent seller and using COC documents for registration cars .... (very popular system in our country)