Excerpts taken from paultan.org:

"While Nanjing Auto bought MG Rover back in July 2005, the forerunner to buy the Rover brand name from BMW was Shanghai Automotive Industry Corp, who actually owns many of Rover’s design rights. SAIC was expected to buy the Rover brand name for US$21.7 million. It had plans to put the Rover 75 back into production in late 2007 or early 2008.

However, SAIC has to change it’s plans now, as Ford whom BMW has given first right of refusal over the Rover brand name has decided to execute it’s rights and buy the brand name from BMW - and it has no plans to resell it later. Ford feels it is essential to own the Rover brand name to protect the interests of it’s Land Rover brand, through which it gained it’s first right of refusal in the first place when it bought Land Rover from BMW in the year 2000."----

Now what SAIC gonna do about this?

It might just be a business trick, first buy and then sell for a much higher price. I think SAIC will make a good offer to get the name...

The cars will be badged as MG,s Im betting on this as here in America few have ever heard of Rover, but most people have heard of MG and have very fond memories of the company. We have already seen pics of rover 75,s badged as MGs and the loss of the rover name wont hurt sales here but it might effect the English sales situation.

I guess your right BIGIRON, Nanjing will sell their MGs in the USA in 2008 using the MG badge.

Then a couple of years later SAIC will try to sell their Rover derived cars under a new Chinese name that nobody has ever heard of and nobody will believe they are really Rovers since everyone will know that Nanjing MG bought MG-Rover.

Very bad news for SAIC and very good news for MG.

"We have already seen pics of rover 75,s badged as MGs " - that was probably a real MG ZT, developed from the Rover 75 about 6 years ago - not just a Rover 75 with an MG badge. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MG_ZT

Adding my two cents, "Shanghai" is a common noun familiar to all, so I don't think going with "Shanghai" brand is not as bad as it sounds.

Or "Rover" brand might come with Aston Martin as a bundle should SAIC choose to buy Aston Martin from Ford...

"Rover" (the name) was purchased by Ford to protect their investment in Land Rover. As long as BMW held "Rover," Ford was assured that there would not be a "Rover" badged SUV. But if someone else owned it, they could produce a Rover SUV that would confuse the market.

"Rover" will only be sold if Land Rover is sold.

SAIC doesn't have the rights to "MG" either. Nanjing purchased those rights.

maybe they should call it fightingtorque. If they offer me 21.7M they can have the internet domain as well.

Personally I think this is a massive blow to SAIC. They have no hope of selling their wannabe Rover in the UK and Europe when you can have the real thing from MG.

I wouldn't write off Rover. According to various reports Ford is looking to relaunch Rover in North America and it may be used by Mazda as a brand to rival Honda's Accura...

Personally I think this is a massive blow to SAIC. They have no hope of selling their wannabe Rover in the UK and Europe when you can have the real thing from MG.

I wouldn't write off Rover. According to various reports Ford is looking to relaunch Rover in North America and it may be used by Mazda as a brand to rival Honda's Accura...
No. Those "various reports" are based on dreams of the articles' authors, not Ford planning. Ford is NOT looking into launching another brand in North America, or anywhere. Ford already maintains three North American brands and four European brands...and Mazda. They have no need for a NINTH brand.

No. Those "various reports" are based on dreams of the articles' authors, not Ford planning. Ford is NOT looking into launching another brand in North America, or anywhere. Ford already maintains three North American brands and four European brands...and Mazda. They have no need for a NINTH brand.

Correct. Ford would have to be crazy if they thought they could get any mileage out of the Rover name. The fact that they offered half of what SAIC were prepared to pay indicates how little value they place on the brand.

welcome BIGIRON, Hudson and Puppetland to Chinacarforums :)

Thanks.

Thanks.

Hey Hudson, whats in your profile picture, i cant tell

Ford's bleeding and is desperately downsizing. So the Rover's going to America theory is pure imaginary.

Hey Hudson, whats in your profile picture, i cant tell
Due to the size limitations of this site, the details have been lost. The picture is of a Bugatti.

1 - Most Americans call a Land Rover a Rover, so buying the Rover nameplate is purely protection against another Rover branded 4x4, especially coming from a company that has a 4x4 model line up already.

2 - Although Ford have stated Land Rover, as speculated, is not for sale with Jaguar, should they decide to sell, it is one less worry for a potential buyer. Knowing that the Land Rover brand would come with the Rover name would add value to the Land Rover sale. It would give the buyer reassurance and potentialy allow a new range of Rover cars alongside the Land Rover brand.

3 - Rover launched the Land Rover in 1949 when Rover was still an independent company prior to its merger with BMC/BL in the late 1960s. Historically, Rover had a quality image, being bought by professional people such as bank managers, and the image of being a car for solid citizens was somewhat changed with the launch of the P6 model in 1963 - a car that was completely different to the conservative models that went before. It won car of the year at the time, and this was followed by the SD1 variant winning the COTY award in 1976, another model that dropped the staid image and went modern and class leading (sadly let down by quality).

Many people feel that this was the start of Rover's demise. Although the 800 was again a solid car in collaboration with Honda that addressed the quality issues of the SD1, it was no longer a trend-setter, and the brand was diluted further by applying the Rover name to the entire range with the exception of the Mini. Rover quality issues improved thanks to Honda but its image was seen as too dowdy, owned by elderly people that drove slowly, reinforced by the media, despite that during the mid-90s the models were good and today are still seen in greater numbers than most of its competition from that period.

The problems came in the late 90s when the competition caught up and lack of new car development meant the smaller Rover models looked to be poor value by comparison. The 75 did offer far greater quality thanks to a state of the art design and assembly (the assembly line was the most advanced in the world at the time) but the media attention over the BMW sale and the new owners under MG Rover meant that the company was doomed to failure. By now the only real market for the MG Rover was the UK, and a number of factors; quality, lack of development, poor dealership experiences, bad press etc combined to seal its fate.

Under a new ownership, with the support of Land Rover, now leading a charmed existence as the "best 4x4xfar", a new range of up-to-date Rover saloons might have a chance. That market would not be the UK, but those countries that still remember Rover as it was prior to the 80s.

Rover as a brand in the US was a failure. All previous attempts to sell over saloons in the US, including under the Sterling brand, failed.

Whilst many enthusiasts are pleased to see the Rover brand back at it's birthplace, Solihull, where Land Rover was born, most are realistic enough to realise that a return of the brand is unlikely given the current competitive marketplace. Many just want the Rover name to die peacefully, just as the Triumph, Morris, Austin, Riley, Wolseley brands were allowed to do, too.

Sadly the English's influence and lifestyle has become a liability of sort in vehicle products.

1 - Most Americans call a Land Rover a Rover...
Yes, but most Americans would respond to "what kind of car do you have" by answering "I think it's a blue one."

Yes, but most Americans would respond to "what kind of car do you have" by answering "I think it's a blue one."


In any country, I think that would be typical of most people's answers!

Actually, in the US the answer is surprisingly quite precise down to the model year and engine capacity or maybe most American males I have spoken to are just plain enthusiasts! Most seem to do their research as they tend to buy cars for a longer ownership period (>7yrs) than most British owners do. They are far less likely to rush into buying a car and surveys such as JD Power have a lot of influence from what I understand talking to many. Needless to say most see their car simply as a means of transport and buy it in the same way they would a computer or other such expensive but necessary item. They seem to research it heavily, and it's only in the last ten years I have a noted a reducing tendency to look at foreign as opposed to US cars. Perhaps because some of the foreign cars are now made in the US that has helped? Performance is not their main priority, or rather, straight power might be in their Pony cars, but handling is often overlooked for ride comfort. Also, the retro theme seems to be have been far more popular there than elsewhere, which means MG having a greater chance with a recognised badge.


Whenever I mentioned my Rover, though, they would launch into their view on the Land Rover, and were quite surprised to find out it was a car I was talking about. Likewise, most seem to think an MG is a two seater sports car like they last saw in 1980, so again, I have to explain I have a saloon, and yes, MG always made saloons!

Many just want the Rover name to die peacefully, just as the Triumph, Morris, Austin, Riley, Wolseley brands were allowed to do, too.
Austin is not dead, Nanjing has invested over $100 milion US in an Austin company this year!

Quote- Zhang Xin (MG Project director):
"More on our brand, Austin, we will refer to the characteristics of the product planning. For example, there are many complicated MG Rover's ancient classic cars, like ancient Chinese rosewood furniture, the appropriate time we will launch our brand."

http://auto.zjol.com.cn/05car/system/2006/09/25/007893415.shtml (http://auto.zjol.com.cn/05car/system...07893415.shtml)
http://www.xhby.net/xhby/content/2006-08/26/content_1379491.htm

Great news, Windy! But Austin was always a "Bread & Butter" brand here, although it did sell ok in the US, but most remember the Austin-Healey sports car. One model that most older Americans will remember is the Austin America based on the ADO16 1100/1300 range in the 1960s, and perhaps the Austin Marina in the 70s.

Great news, Windy! But Austin was always a "Bread & Butter" brand here
I think Zhang Xin is saying that when they start producing "Bread & Butter" cars then they will revive Austin, at the moment they are reviving the MG TF, MG ZT and Rover 75 - they are not "Bread & Butter" cars and will be MGs.

(I've corrected the link if anyone who can read Chinese properly would like to comment)

Actually, in the US the answer is surprisingly quite precise down to the model year and engine capacity or maybe most American males I have spoken to are just plain enthusiasts!
You got lucky. MOST Americans treat the automobile like the appliance that it is. There are a large number car enthusiasts who will tell you amazing details on their vehicles of choice...but "large number" pales in comparison to the 200 million drivers in the US today. And precious few Americans understand their automotive history, though.

A Land Rover is NOT a "Rover"...it is a "Land Rover."

Windy
Sorry, didn't mean to sound demeaning by using the term Bread & Butter, should have said less exciting brand, but you're right, it does make sense to use it on the mainstream models. Many people felt that the Rover brand was diluted when cars previously badged as Austin were then badged as Rover. however, Austin and Morris were two of the main rivals at one time with the Mini originaly being launched as both Austin and Morris to cater for the brand loyalty amongst buyers. And of course, the Austin 7 is to Britain what the Ford Model T was in the US, and the 7 got BMW on its feet way back in the 1930s. So much heritage to play on. By the way I am a fan of the Austin having owned this rare Austin, www.austinapache.co.uk

Hudson, I think that comment applies to most countries - for many the only real concern is that it starts in the morning! Here in the UK it seemed that deliberately or otherwise, most called the MG saloons Rovers! It was not uncommon to see the media refer to them as Rover, and many used the term, rebadged Rover, which of course it was, but the rebadging went deeper than many realised or gave the MGs credit for.

Windy
Sorry, didn't mean to sound demeaning by using the term Bread & Butter, should have said less exciting brand,
Actually I understood that and I think its a good description of Austins past, although with this being an international site maybe others didn't.

Not sure Nanjing think of it quite that way though, in an interview published today and while opening their new engine factory in Nanjing, MG Project Director Zhang Xin has given us some more info on the future of Austin:

http://auto.sina.com.cn/news/2006-09-26/1347218476.shtml

Zhang Xin :

It mainly depends on the marketing plan, as we now have 20 brands.

Will be conducted in accordance with the strategy of marketing and promoting product planning.

Austin, because it has connotations of the brand, and the MG brand is not the same connotation, which used to reflect the aspirations of the middle and vector handling, we will be a classic cars, and Austin linked to the above brands, the response to defy history, we have done a very exaggerated Concept Cars That the revival of the Austin, into a space vehicle, these are marketing people need to do."

http://image2.sina.com.cn/qc/news/2006-09-26/U1654P33T2D218476F9DT20060926140004.jpg
Zhang Xin, general manager of Nanjing MG

Here in the UK it seemed that deliberately or otherwise, most called the MG saloons Rovers! It was not uncommon to see the media refer to them as Rover, and many used the term, rebadged Rover, which of course it was, but the rebadging went deeper than many realised or gave the MGs credit for.
In this case, that seems to be more correct. Since Ford has never produced a "Rover" Land Rover, there's no reason to call the vehicles "Rover" (aside from the "lazy American" attitude).

As for MGs being called Rovers....MG Rover couldn't be too upset about that. MG Rover didn't own the Rover name and needed to move the whole brand to a more stable nameplate...one they owned. Equating the MG vehicles and the Rover vehicles shouldn't have been a problem.

In the US, however, nobody knows what Rover is. Yes, we had the old Rover 2000/3500 and the later SD1 3500 (the Sterling doesn't count since it wasn't sold as a Rover in the US), but nobody remembers them except for British car enthusiasts. MG, however, holds many memories and should have great brand recognition if Nanjing were to ever launch the brand in the US.

I heard - I think it was on BBC's "Top Gear" - that TVR would like to buy the MG brand. Any news on that?

And by the way: the Rover 75 was a nice car, well constructed by BMW. But even at its time it was hardly competitable with "real" BMWs like the E46 3-series, and even non-premium cars like the VW Passat scoort much higher in all quality related issues. And if SAIC plans to put this back into production in 2009 or later this car will be hopelessly overaged. Who wants to buy that?

David

I heard - I think it was on BBC's "Top Gear" - that TVR would like to buy the MG brand. Any news on that?
There was talk of that, but I believe that's old news. Nanjing, apparently, has the rights to the MG name.