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cryptonx said:
made
I drove a chery a11( i am not chinese ) and compared it to my Dads 1995 Toyota Corrolla .. performance / comfortable / space wise, the chery is alot better

the only thing I didnt like was the plastic looking interior

my dads 1994 corrolla had no abs no airbags and it costs x2 the cost of the chery NOW . the new 2006 corrolla costs 3x the chery a11 and doesn't come with abs not even a cd-player and not even sport rims .

Toyota corrolas waranty is 3 years - 60,000 KM here
Cherys Waranty is 4 years - 90,000 KM


!

does the Chery A11 in egypt look like this



or like this



and are there alot of them in egypt
 

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the 1st one

and yes they are becoming ALOT ,, in the street i live in there's 2 already
so the QQ , they are becoming the no.1 girls car

And I know alot of ppl who do own it , no one complains , everyone is happy

the only things they dont like so far is the Loud engine and the Cheap interior then again when they consider the price they bought it for , they think it was very fair and very value for money .

i mean c'mon for $10,000 you get a
16V Sohc FORD CVH 1.6L - 95 HP Engine
93 Seat Toledo chasis
Valeo A/C - 2 siemens APV airbags - ABS with EPD
Power windows and Power mirrors
5 x 14" Alloy wheels
great trunk space
large sedane compared to the accent and lanos .

4 years waranty !

nothing could go wrong I guess
 

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Discussion Starter · #43 ·
93 Seat Toledo chasis
Valeo A/C - 2 siemens APV airbags - ABS with EPD
Old Toledo chassis makes it sure that the airbags are rendered useless in an actual crash. Just go watch a Landwind crash test video if you need a proof.
 

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the Ford CVH engine is 8v not 16v, although Chery are considering developing a 16v version of that engine.

A11 is available with 16v engine, originally the tritec engine (like BMW mini engine) and now they will install their new AVL designed units.
 

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fightingtorque said:
the Ford CVH engine is 8v not 16v, although Chery are considering developing a 16v version of that engine.

A11 is available with 16v engine, originally the tritec engine (like BMW mini engine) and now they will install their new AVL designed units.

Is the AVL V6 available in any car yet. What about the V8
 

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To answer the question of this topic.

No, you shouldn't buy a Chinese car if it does not offer the most value for your money - assuming that is your primary decision factor.

As we all know, lots of other factors influence car buying decisions - such as brand loyalty or even peer pressure. But for the sake of simplifying things, let's assume "value" is the only factor here.

For the Chinese cars to succeed in let's say the US market, the car must first be well designed and made. That's the minimum requirement for this market. Anything less, just forget it.

Then toss in a super long warranty to ease the fear of a new, unproven brand.

And of course, have the low sticker price to bring people in.

The Toyota Yaris for $10,500? That tiny bare-boned 3 door? If a Chinese car company can bring you a 4 door sedan, fully loaded, well designed and made, with a 10 year warranty, for under $10,000; I would think there's enough reason to take a good look at it.

The Geely CK show at Detroit is pathetic. I hope they never bring that. Give us a new version please.
 

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at Fighting Torque

My mistake
THen the one being sold here is using the TRITEC engine , since the Dealer here is 100% sure that its 16V / SOHC using some double thing I didnty quite understand which makes it 16v not 8v .
 

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you definitely want to make sure of this - the price in china for the tritec engine version was much higher, it should be a much better engine.

but the tritec engine version was never offered in china in the earlier style bumpers car (top one in the pictures).

have a look at the engine - if 16v then the spark plugs are in the center of the engine, down through the middle of the cover. if the plugs are next to the exhaust manifold outlets then it's the ford origin 8v engine.

only good thing for the 8v engine is when it's turbocharged.........
 

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cryptonx said:
the 1st one

and yes they are becoming ALOT ,, in the street i live in there's 2 already
so the QQ , they are becoming the no.1 girls car

And I know alot of ppl who do own it , no one complains , everyone is happy

the only things they dont like so far is the Loud engine and the Cheap interior then again when they consider the price they bought it for , they think it was very fair and very value for money .

i mean c'mon for $10,000 you get a
16V Sohc FORD CVH 1.6L - 95 HP Engine
93 Seat Toledo chasis
Valeo A/C - 2 siemens APV airbags - ABS with EPD
Power windows and Power mirrors
5 x 14" Alloy wheels
great trunk space
large sedane compared to the accent and lanos .

4 years waranty !

nothing could go wrong I guess
Or I could get a used '95 bmw m3 with 240 hp, leather seats, power everything, cd changer, 17 by 8 inch sport wheels and suspension and great looks with wicked preformance. Or a used BMW 528i. Or a host of other used luxury cars or mid-range cars by more reputable brands, many of the cars still under warruntee.
 

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fm.illuminatus said:
Or I could get a used '95 bmw m3 with 240 hp, leather seats, power everything, cd changer, 17 by 8 inch sport wheels and suspension and great looks with wicked preformance. Or a used BMW 528i. Or a host of other used luxury cars or mid-range cars by more reputable brands, many of the cars still under warruntee.

WTF are you talking about, That dude lives in Egypt, you can't buy a used 95 bmw M3 in egypt. And even if you buy one in the US the car will break down. The reason most people sell their used cars in the first place is because their cars already have hugh problems and likely will break down, you'll end up calling a tow truck before you drive your car home.
 

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a used 95 bmw will still cost more than a new chery A11 here ,

you have to know something about the market here , ppl dont like to lose money !

IE , Daewoo Lanos ( not the new aveo ) is still on sale in Egypt ( Because its being built by some stupid egyptian factory ) for $11500

then you think that why not get a used 1999 Daewoo Lanos for example ! it would be still good and cheap ! to discover that the usesd lanos are in range of $8500 to $9500
which is totally useless

a used BMW 95 ( not even the m5 , just the regular 5 series ) costs $16000

Not to mention the 90,000 KM or even more !

funny classfieds : " BMW 316i 98 - JUST LIKE NEW ! 120,000 KM "
see ? this is considered a brand new car .. how much this one costs ? $21000 !

how much does the new BMW 320i cost ? ( which btw is beeing put together in egypt not imported , which means it should be cheaper , u think :D ) its for
$60,000 :D hehe

what a country I live in !
so you see chery has all the " FLAVOURS " of being a winner here , value for money here is a very bi issue !

except for mafioso kids , who just wants to buy a car that no one else has :D( I am not one , altho I wish I was )
 

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why all this talk about secondhand BMWs? I mean I've got a '93 530i back in England, it's a nice car, but I'm sure it isn't as fast as a Ferrari.

I use it to get the shopping and stuff. My wife likes driving it, it's comfortable.

But it's no Ferrari eater......
 

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hazik said:
WTF are you talking about, That dude lives in Egypt, you can't buy a used 95 bmw M3 in egypt. And even if you buy one in the US the car will break down. The reason most people sell their used cars in the first place is because their cars already have hugh problems and likely will break down, you'll end up calling a tow truck before you drive your car home.
Didn't realize he lived in egypt.

However, your attitude on used cars is rediculous. I haven't bought a new car in my life, and I've had some used cars that have been perfect (I had a BMW 525i and a BMW 325xi with absolutely no problems) and some with a few issues (my 540i needed some maintence and tires and my 740il is a disaster in terms of maintenence). Buying a used car is just a matter of doing your research. There are plenty of reasons people sell their used cars: they want something newer, are bored with what they have, want something more powerful, need something larger for the family, want something the handles better, etc. Simply unloading their junker on someone else is at the bottom of the list, and although it happens all the time, normally if you pull a carfax report you can avoid getting a lemon.
 

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cryptonx said:
a used 95 bmw will still cost more than a new chery A11 here ,

you have to know something about the market here , ppl dont like to lose money !

IE , Daewoo Lanos ( not the new aveo ) is still on sale in Egypt ( Because its being built by some stupid egyptian factory ) for $11500

then you think that why not get a used 1999 Daewoo Lanos for example ! it would be still good and cheap ! to discover that the usesd lanos are in range of $8500 to $9500
which is totally useless

a used BMW 95 ( not even the m5 , just the regular 5 series ) costs $16000

Not to mention the 90,000 KM or even more !

funny classfieds : " BMW 316i 98 - JUST LIKE NEW ! 120,000 KM "
see ? this is considered a brand new car .. how much this one costs ? $21000 !

how much does the new BMW 320i cost ? ( which btw is beeing put together in egypt not imported , which means it should be cheaper , u think :D ) its for
$60,000 :D hehe

what a country I live in !
so you see chery has all the " FLAVOURS " of being a winner here , value for money here is a very bi issue !

except for mafioso kids , who just wants to buy a car that no one else has :D( I am not one , altho I wish I was )
Oh, see, I didn't realize we where talking about chery in egypt. I though you were talking about bringin Chery to the U.S.
 

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fm.i , I wrote that in my Ferrari phase, don't worry about it. Much respect to your 540, I have an E34 530i touring with the V8 motor.

In England, I would also never consider buying a new car with my own money. However, Egypt may be a bit like China: in China, because the car sales have been growing every year, there aren't that many older cars around compared to the potential demand. Certainly in China I wouldn't buy a secondhand car, because people's expectations of value are just way too high - I'm going back a couple of years now but I've met people who bought secondhand cars with 300k km on the clock for around 40% of the new car price - in England that mileage would put the value at 10% of new or less.
 

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Hi Torque,

I've just watched the clips on your site, it's quite funny to see the Chery vs F430 video. I'm surprised it sort of almost 'kept up' with the Ferrari, and not been tossed aside. Granted the F430 driver is a bit weak, guess this really shows that sometimes the driver is more important than car spec.

What's the spec on that car and have you done the mods on it?

Also are those silver cars Lioncels? I quite like them :). If the underpinnings are the same as old Mitsu Lancers, then there's tons of modding potential. My dad bought one of these in China, and last year when I was visiting him I kept thinking we should mod it, first step, add a TD-04 turbo charger :D.

P.S. you are not one of the Rover engineers that got hired by SAIC and now based in Shanghai are you? :)
 

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The Chery is not highly modified, the engine has a high lift cam and a pair of weber DCOE 40's (all ebay stuff!), chinese made sports exhaust system and a user programmable ECU running the ignition. I set it all up over a few late nights tearing up and down a quite road with my wideband ecu, g-force data logger and a bit of laptop work. it doesn't run perfectly, but it runs....

The suspension on the latest video (F430 one) is a bilstein non-adjustable sports kit that the chinadragonracing.com man had on the shelf (same as mk2 golf), whilst for brakes you can do a straight swap to santanna 2000 vented discs using calipers from the old audi 100, and it has (had, I just had to replace them as they were worn out!) Ferodo DS2000 pads.

Suspension on the earlier videos is more or less standard.

Most of the cars you mention in the videos are Lioncell's, but one or two are actually Mitsi Evo's - today I have just added a video clip taken inside an Evo, maybe doesn't look it in the clip but it was a really quick bit of kit.

I have seen 3 turbocharged Lioncells in shanghai, I know one of them was built by Sam's tuning shop, not sure about the others. One of them (a black one) is really quick on the track, I think he's made some times just outside 1min 20 (Evo Brian's real Evo with an extra 400cc and 4 wheel drive makes about 1.18.). They are definitely a car with potential, also since the 2.0 mitsubishi 4G63 (in non turbo form) engine is also produced in China, it should be possible to build something up....

Having said that, in the 1600 NA category it's the Honda Fits that are now the big news on the track, one of them posted a 1.23.25 last time I think, the guys have coilover suspension and big brakes but I think the engines are mainly just standard with air filter and exhaust changes. Still, 1.5 litres with VTEC in a small car gives them a bit of speed.

No, I don't work for Rover/ SAIC, I'm in engine components, although I know some of those guys as we are doing business.....

If you read Chinese ( just guessing from your 'Dad' comment) then have a look at www.cdr-club.com and www.stc2002.com which is the tianma circuit website which also has a forum.

cheers, FT
 

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FT, cheers for the info and link, I'm going to have a read.

I got a question - what are the grades of petrol on sale in China? in the UK there's the standard 95RON unleaded and 97/98RON premium stuff, Tesco has started selling a 99RON blend with 5% ethanol.

My car (tuned Saab 9-5) shows markable difference when running on low and high grade. With 97/98 grade there's less knocking, more willing to pull and better MPG as well. Does your race organisers regulate the fuel grade?

While I was travelling in China last year I noted there seem to be 2 brands of petrol stations (all state owned?). Sino Pec or something and the other one :). there's no foreign filling stations like Shell. Can you get race grade fuel for track days or is it ordinary stuff from the pump?
 
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