[Real_I_Hate_China]

GM is now offering 5yr/100K transferable warranty on all its US models, to compete with Japanese.

US market warranty

GM : 5 year/100K mile
Chrysler : 5 year/70K mile
Hyundai/Kia : 10 year/100K mile
Mitsubish : 10 year/100K mile
Suzuki : 10 year/100K mile

100K mile warranty has become a common place in the market and Chinese has to offer even higher to attract customers, preferably something like 10 year/150K miles.

Unfortunately, most Chinese cars have a designed life span of half that.
** If your going to make such bold statements, please try to prove them

 

[Dennis Juan Sanabria]

Why GM have big factories in Chaina?

Mr. I HATE CHAINAo you now: Why GM have big factories in Chaina? Other question? Do you read the contract, of the 100.000 miles? What they give? And how many cars have "RECALLS in USA" ?...

 

[Real_I_Hate_China]

** If your going to make such bold statements, please try to prove them

Well, half of 150K miles is 75K miles, or 120,000 km.

A design life span of 120,000 km means the vast majority of cars should have covered this distance without some major repair/replacement work done on them, such as engine rebuild, transmission repair, driving shaft repair, etc.

Now how many Chinese brand cars display an odometer reading of 120,000 km? Let's take an example of 1999 Chery Qiyun; what percentage of 1999 models are still on the road with an odometer reading greater than 120,000 km?

 

[phaeton]

Now how many Chinese brand cars display an odometer reading of 120,000 km? Let's take an example of 1999 Chery Qiyun; what percentage of 1999 models are still on the road with an odometer reading greater than 120,000 km?

Do you have proof thats not made up of these cars being off the road.

REAL_I_HATE_CHINA I respect you opinions but don't make stuff up just to be heard it makes your future info look like false accusations

 

[gr8]

i think for the average ppl the five year would probally finish off faster than the 100mil

 

[Dennis Juan Sanabria]

GWM cars in Costa Rica with more 250.000 km old

Greatwall cars in Costa Rica have more them 3 years old (250.000 KM) We have diferents customers (TAXI CAP, RENT A CARS,etc) and are workin very good.
What do you think aboute that!!!!

Jeep recalls target cooling-fan blades, seat heaters
The Chrysler group is recalling nearly 150,000 Jeep Grand Cherokees because cooling-fan blades may break and hurt people near the vehicle if the hood is open. This and other recalls that automakers reported to NHTSA. story
Published: 10:15 AM, ET, 7/28/06
And I have more recalls in USA of: Ford, Toyota...
Please enter in: www.autonews.com and I proof all the racalls
If you have somke recalls of Greatwall, please sen me...:thumb: Thanks.

 

[Real_I_Hate_China]

Greatwall cars in Costa Rica have more them 3 years old (250.000 KM) We have diferents customers (TAXI CAP, RENT A CARS,etc) and are workin very good.
What do you think aboute that!!!!

Actually cabs and fleet vehicles are serviced frequently and their life span tend to be short, so they can carry a longer mileage around.

The question is about vehicles owned by individuals, which aren't always serviced timely and must operate under unoptimal conditions.

80K mile was tough on Japanese cars just 12 years ago too. Long-term durability is a result of a learned experience over decades, an experience that Chinese do not posseess as of yet. Illegal Chinese replicas of foreign vehicles aren't as durable as the foreigh originals simply because Chinese could not replicate the specific chemical composition of parts such as engine alloy, seals and paint. Durability is a feature that Chinese must learn by trial and error from decades of experiences of selling and fixing cars.

The very fact that it is hard to find 10 year old Chinese vehicles on the street is the proof of problems with Chinese durability.

 

[Real_I_Hate_China]

The point is that 100K mile warranty is now becoming a common place in the US market, and Chinese must offer something better than this to sell their cars here because of high customer expectations, in spite of their inexperiences building durable vehicles.

Automotive market scene wasn't this tough when the Japanese and the Koreans entered the US market.

 

[Dennis Juan Sanabria]

Why in USA cars have thousands of Recalls?

If they use special parts and special material,and is the perfect vehicle, why they have thounsand of "reacalls"
You give me the reasson, all depend the class of drive conductor and the class of maintenance of the car. Dont hate China. Peace and Love.:thumb:

 

[fightingtorque]

Illegal Chinese replicas of foreign vehicles aren't as durable as the foreigh originals simply because Chinese could not replicate the specific chemical composition of parts such as engine alloy, seals and paint.

No. For example Chery and Brilliance new engine cylinder block, head, pistons, rings, bearings, gaskets, spark plugs, heat shields, valves, cam followers, and I am sure a lot of other parts are made by Chinese operations of foreign companies using the same material specs.

I happened to meet the gentleman who sold the paint and painting facility to chery recently. It was a German company.

You continuously ignore the information that I have hinted to you about the chinese auto component industry just because once you read on the internet that Honda said they used nearly all import parts in the car they make in china and export. You didn't understand that they are trying to allay the fears of people like you who would be frightened of buying a chinese made car even if it was a Honda because of some racist issues that you have.

The very fact that it is hard to find 10 year old Chinese vehicles on the street is the proof of problems with Chinese durability.

These companies haven't been building cars for 10 years. That's why you don't see any 10 year old chinese cars on the road.

Actually I don't entirely disagree with your sentiment about the experience curve, it is a valid point. But not the way you try to explain it.

 

[fightingtorque]

Now how many Chinese brand cars display an odometer reading of 120,000 km? Let's take an example of 1999 Chery Qiyun; what percentage of 1999 models are still on the road with an odometer reading greater than 120,000 km?

1 Actually the Qiyun was not available in 1999, that was the Fengyun.
SOURCE: I was there.

2. Most of the early cars were sold as taxis in Wuhu city. Most are still running but will be scrapped soon because Chinese taxi regulations require that taxis be not more than 8 years old ( or younger in shanghai).
SOURCE: I was there, talking to taxi drivers.
Unfortunately I can't give you a percentage, why don't you make one up and say you found it on the internet.

3. Taxis in china cover about 120 - 150k km each year. Yes, maintenance is adhered to and the drivers try to look after them, but on the other hand it's a difficult environment - the roads are not in as good condition, there is more dust, and there are some extremes of temperature. The fuel is also not so good which gives rise to some additional problems. (SOURCE: Personal involvement in numerous engine dynamometer tests). I am always amazed at how well these chinese taxis stand up to such high mileages - it's quite common to find yourself in a taxi with 500k plus on the clock and I've been in a few million km cars.
SOURCE: Taxi drivers in Qingdao, Wuhu and elsewhere.

Taxi drivers in wuhu have told me that the engine in the fengyun has a slightly shorter time to overhaul than the VW. However, it is still the case that most taxis get to end of life with only one major overhaul somewhere between 300 and 450k km so it doesn't make a big difference to them.
SOURCE: Taxi drivers in Wuhu.


The biggest complaint is that when the cam belt breaks on a VW jetta or santana engine there is no internal damage (valve to piston clearance is sufficient) whereas in the Fengyun's Ford CVH origin engine you have contact. However, it is the VW that is unusual in this respect, rather than the other way around. I doubt the modern VW engines have enough clearance to survive this. I have spoken with one cambelt manufacturer who felt that the conditions (heat and dust) may contribute to cambelt failure, but the main issue was that because it was always all right on the vw, people had become accustomed to not paying attention to cambelt condition/ routine replacement.
SOURCE: Talking to a western general manager of a chinese operation of a foreign belt company.

 

[fightingtorque]

1 Actually the Qiyun was not available in 1999, that was the Fengyun.
SOURCE: I was there.

In fact I don't think it was called Fengyun then, might just have been called Chery. I forget. Doesn't matter.

 

[dragin]

looking back

“The first time I came to China, I saw a local version of the first generation Toledo I had designed for Seat in 1988. I thought the car was built by one of VW group's two local joint ventures. But I was wrong. It was a clone made by Chery.”
(Ital design’s Chairman Giorgetto Giugiaro to Autoweek.com, August13,2004)

I think GG is talking here about the A11 Fengyun, first produced in 1999. Maybe someone can tell us when it began to be called the Fengyun.

 

[dragin]

paint

.......I happened to meet the gentleman who sold the paint and painting facility to chery recently. It was a German company.......

Yes FT that company is the distinguished DURR, a company with more than a hundred years of tradition. I think the tough looking paint finish speaks for itself.

 

[fightingtorque]

Yes FT that company is the distinguished DURR, a company with more than a hundred years of tradition. I think the tough looking paint finish speaks for itself.

Correct.

 

[BringIt]

Chinese cars are not up to international standards, I think we all know that.

But the assumption that Chinese cars will forever remain in their current state is illogical, if not downright stupid.

Just look at how far they have come in the past 5, 10, 15 years.

5 years from now? I'd be driving them in the US, no doubt.