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Hello Micodeljia, this picture is used by Fiat in her Turin case against Great Wall.
The whole case is amazing: Fiat == Great Wall, Turin == Shijiazhuang, Italy (Europe) == China?
Even the comment on this picture is reversed to your opinion:
"This computer-enhanced photo of the Great Wall Peri shows in orange what sources say are the only design differences between the Peri and the Fiat Panda."
See: http://www.autonews.com/apps/pbcs.d.../COPY01/829890072/-1/chicgo&template=printart

I am very sorry to say so, because I like their enthousiasm (and a lot of Chinese friends think the same about this ..) but Great Wall (like BYD) is a bloody copier.
Examples:
Great Wall Hover: body inspired by Isuzu Aixom.
Great Wall Wingle: front end copied from Volkswagen Magellan.
Great Wall Peri: body copied from Fiat Panda.
Great Wall Florid: body copied from Toyota/ Scion xA.
Great Wall Phenom (I7): body based on Toyota Yaris.
Great Wall Feelfine (CH051): body based on Toyota Rectis/Corolla Verso.
Great Wall Coolbear; body inspired by Toyota/Scion xB.
Great Wall Cowry (V08): body inspired by Toyota Noah.
And when I say "inspired" I am very friendly.
I haven't talked about the platforms of of the cars, but I think they are copied from the Toyota Yaris.
Greetings,
 

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I don't know what Jonathan means. But I know that BYD showed at the Beijing Show photos of their new S3 SUV. It came out that the photos (in official BYD publications) are stolen photos from the new Toyota RAV4.
Here the thumbnails, left the BYD and right the Toyota.
 

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erik (laofan) said:
Hello Micodeljia, this picture is used by Fiat in her Turin case against Great Wall.
The whole case is amazing: Fiat == Great Wall, Turin == Shijiazhuang, Italy (Europe) == China?
Even the comment on this picture is reversed to your opinion:
"This computer-enhanced photo of the Great Wall Peri shows in orange what sources say are the only design differences between the Peri and the Fiat Panda."
See: http://www.autonews.com/apps/pbcs.d.../COPY01/829890072/-1/chicgo&template=printart

I am very sorry to say so, because I like their enthousiasm (and a lot of Chinese friends think the same about this ..) but Great Wall (like BYD) is a bloody copier.
Examples:
Great Wall Hover: body inspired by Isuzu Aixom.
Great Wall Wingle: front end copied from Volkswagen Magellan.
Great Wall Peri: body copied from Fiat Panda.
Great Wall Florid: body copied from Toyota/ Scion xA.
Great Wall Phenom (I7): body based on Toyota Yaris.
Great Wall Feelfine (CH051): body based on Toyota Rectis/Corolla Verso.
Great Wall Coolbear; body inspired by Toyota/Scion xB.
Great Wall Cowry (V08): body inspired by Toyota Noah.
And when I say "inspired" I am very friendly.
I haven't talked about the platforms of of the cars, but I think they are copied from the Toyota Yaris.
Greetings,
ok...let's go step by step, i am informed that gwm had somekind of cooperation between them and fiat,and somewhere that failed, now is very difficult to discuss about it but here is what it is

great wall cooperation with toyota, long time gwm did a joint venture jobs for toyota, even some parts are equal to toyota parts, and od some car's there was parts with orginal toyota logo on it,also great wall buy whole production line of toyota and then the models like deer(toyota hilux 2001 model) and safe (old toyota 4 runner) was produced, also with that GW 1.3 EFI engine produced by great wall toyota give their tehnology to them,long time gwm buys some old models of toyota,the same is like mitsubishi engine, gwm always have older versions of engines, we can all wonder how that coolbear, florid and other models was made

great wall with isuzu, great wall long time work with isuzu, especcialy because of engines, 4JB1 ISUZU, GW4D28 ENGINE...and all newer diesel engines from gwm are based on isuzu, also gwm buy a licence from isuzu for axiom model, because that model have very bad selling results in american market...and still it was quite useful, italians torino design did a whole new mask of hover...so you can't say that hovere is a copy of isuzu, becase gwm legal buy that,the same situation is for wingle....wingle is a vehicle completly based on isuzu-dmax model, interior is the same like from old model od d-max, also that rear bumper and chasis, as i know volkswagen used that concept for their newer cars in group like audi q7 etc, ant that car was never in production

in this modern time it's always easier way to outbuy some older model and do a restyiling if is possible, especcially this is popular in china, many other european brands there still selling their older models...like jetta, peugeot 206, citroen bx bla bla bla, so i hope that in future they will start to produce models which is orginal, this will be also very difficult because in R&D department of gwm there is many workers from europe, japan etc..
 

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Hello Micodelija,

I agree with your conclusion "i hope that in future they will start to produce models which are orginal", I am happy our dispute brings us to the same conclusion.
Still I don't agree with a number of things you are telling. It would be nice if you have any proof to show me that I am wrong.

Fiat-Great Wall: there has never been any cooperation between Fiat and Great Wall. I wonder if it is someone from Great Wall who tells you this?

Toyota-Great Wall: Great Wall never worked for Toyota. The fact that Great Wall has at sometime used original Toyota parts doesn't prove anything: Chery used VW parts for their Fengyun (Toledo) chassis, VW complained about this at SAIC, at that time partner in Chery, and SAIC decided to drop out Chery. And than Chery was blocked by Chinese court to use any VW parts. And note this wonderful Landcruiser story, at picture 4 you can see the logo of the Huaxiang Fuqi, which in fact the car is. http://free.21cn.com/forum/bbsMessageList.act?currentPage=1&bbsThreadId=1569609.
No, like so many Chinese SUV companies (maybe more than 10) Great Wall just uses the Toyota models as their great example, without any approval.
Their small, new Toyota copies like Coolbear and Florid are designed by TJ Innova in Shanghai. In 2006 at the Beijing show the TJ Innova booth was near the Great Wall booth, I asked the TJ Innova general manager how he could explain me the fact that TJ Innova copied all these Toyota models, and he replied that China has a right to copy foreign models as long as China is backward to these countries. So TJ Innova thinks it has a right to steal till China is fully developed. They told me nothing about any agreement with Toyota.

The stories about the Hover and the Wingle are also not true, there is not any relationship or agreement between Great Wall and Isuzu. I wonder who does you believe this, can you give me any proof. Again, I can imagine people at Great Wall can say things like this, just to defend or justify themselves.

I agree cars nowadays are look-a-likes, (they were that already in the 1920s!!), but still there are companies, also in China, who make interesting new models which are not bloody copies, for instance like Brilliance.

Micodelija, I hope you can give some proof (I really hope I am wrong) but unless that, I will remain to my ideas.
 

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OMG what kind of mentality is this ? China will be forever backward with these type of people.

At least Brilliance is doing some works with the FRV.

TJ Innova and GWM can rot in hell if they carry on with this attitude.

TJ Innova is the same people that design the Lifan Passat, correct ?

The funny thing is when you try to enter TJ Innova site, it says "the page cannot be found"

lol what kind of company is that.

And look at this , their concept





people say it is the copy of Renault Fluence concept



 

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erik (laofan) said:
Hello Micodelija,

I agree with your conclusion "i hope that in future they will start to produce models which are orginal", I am happy our dispute brings us to the same conclusion.
Still I don't agree with a number of things you are telling. It would be nice if you have any proof to show me that I am wrong.

Fiat-Great Wall: there has never been any cooperation between Fiat and Great Wall. I wonder if it is someone from Great Wall who tells you this?

Toyota-Great Wall: Great Wall never worked for Toyota. The fact that Great Wall has at sometime used original Toyota parts doesn't prove anything: Chery used VW parts for their Fengyun (Toledo) chassis, VW complained about this at SAIC, at that time partner in Chery, and SAIC decided to drop out Chery. And than Chery was blocked by Chinese court to use any VW parts. And note this wonderful Landcruiser story, at picture 4 you can see the logo of the Huaxiang Fuqi, which in fact the car is. http://free.21cn.com/forum/bbsMessageList.act?currentPage=1&bbsThreadId=1569609.
No, like so many Chinese SUV companies (maybe more than 10) Great Wall just uses the Toyota models as their great example, without any approval.
Their small, new Toyota copies like Coolbear and Florid are designed by TJ Innova in Shanghai. In 2006 at the Beijing show the TJ Innova booth was near the Great Wall booth, I asked the TJ Innova general manager how he could explain me the fact that TJ Innova copied all these Toyota models, and he replied that China has a right to copy foreign models as long as China is backward to these countries. So TJ Innova thinks it has a right to steal till China is fully developed. They told me nothing about any agreement with Toyota.

The stories about the Hover and the Wingle are also not true, there is not any relationship or agreement between Great Wall and Isuzu. I wonder who does you believe this, can you give me any proof. Again, I can imagine people at Great Wall can say things like this, just to defend or justify themselves.

I agree cars nowadays are look-a-likes, (they were that already in the 1920s!!), but still there are companies, also in China, who make interesting new models which are not bloody copies, for instance like Brilliance.

Micodelija, I hope you can give some proof (I really hope I am wrong) but unless that, I will remain to my ideas.
you have intresting opinion...but here is my, i don't know why you always look for some kind of proff? does small people who want to buy cheap car and have cheap expences for it care about it? i am not a lawyer to bother with things like this...and personaly i really don't care about it :) until all of my cars works ok

first models of great wall, deer, safe...i saw in that company whole production line, on some of them there is still toyota logo on it,i am sure that nobody put the stickers of toyota logo's on it, so by my opinion gwm must contact them and outbuy that production line, so you can't say that gwm don't have any cooperation with toyota, i am not in top managment of great wall to know what they do, but by this what i see it was my conclusion

same is with isuzu, some vehicles from great wall have original engine of isuzu on it, that 4JB1 enigne, with isuzu logo on it,so this means that company cooperate with them....now gwm produce that engine by their own, called 4D28 engine, same is with that mitsubishi engine in hover 4G64..i saw in company the same engine with great wall logo on it and it's called GW2.4S engine

for fiat i know that fiat try to find a partner for chinese market because there they have very bad selling results, i hear that they already change couple of partners which produce vehicles from them, we can all wonder how peri was designed...by my opinion i think that some europeans which work in gwm...used this idea and finalized it, the same story was in cherry when daewoo enginerrs was sacked and lost job, they find a job in china and bring there all documentation for procudtion of daewoo matiz model,just sold it there like cherry qq model
 

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TJ Innova also allegedly copied the Citroën ZX for Shanghai Maple and Lifan. I'm not allowed to post links because I'm below 10 posts :( but googling "bootleg Citroëns" will get you there.

(Erik knows this already, of course, since the Citroënet site thanks him for information, but it's worth pointing out that TJ Innova have 'form' for this kind of behaviour.)
 

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mememe said:
Mico.

Do you think GWM is present in Georgia ? coz I saw a footage and it keeps on puzzling me if those police pickups are GW.
Exactly i had the same feeling.
I remember seeing on tv a road block of this georgean police suv that was crashed by a russian tank.
This is tougher than ncap crash test!
 

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Great Wall Gwperi finally ruled as copy of Fiat Panda!

September 19, 2008 - A Turin appeals court last week made the final ruling that prevents a minicar GWPeri, manufactured by China's Great Wall Motor, from being imported into Europe, Fiat China company said to Nanfang Daily yesterday.

A local court in Turin said in its ruling on 16 July, "the Gwperi does not look like a different car but is a Fiat Panda with a different front end." The court has ruled that the vehicle will not be allowed into Europe and also ordered Great Wall Motor to pay 15,000 euros (US$23,553) in penalty.

Another 50,000 euros will be charged on each model if the company continues to bring the car to Europe. Great Wall Motor appealed against the ruling immediately. In the final ruling, the Turin appeals court also upheld fines issued against Great Wall in July by the lower court.

"Gwperi is never expected to be introduced to Europe," Great Wall Motor spokesman Shang Yugui said. Earlier, he was quoted many times as saying that Turin's ruling is unfair and its only aim is to protect Italy's own auto industry, as they are afraid the launch of Great Wall Gwperi may hurt the sales of Fiat Panda."

The ruling will not affect Gwperi exports to other countries, Shang added.

From:Gasgoo.com
 

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thank you my friend on your nice wishes :) i also hope that buisness will go very well, especially when we got new vehicles from passenger car segment :thumb:, on the opening was 2 televisons, 10 press medians, local politicians,managers of big companies, president of the county and chinese ammbasador :)

i also expect that opening will be very soon also on great wall official website
 

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very soon we will have new hover and wingle pick up with euro 4 engines, this in showroom are old models which are all euro 3 but have OBD sistem, also most of them we usually sold with LPG, so you don't must to pay a taxes for emmison

also new coming passenger cars are all euro 4, like peri, florid, coolbear, cowry
 
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