Micheal you will definitely spark debategod_bless_japan said:Hi i just joined today, and am not i hate china,
Also competition is a good thing (xbox and ps3 for example)
what we have with china and korea is not competion but dependence on Japan to make cars electronics. India is the same, bajaj and lml scooters are based on Piaggio italy and their truck of Merc Benz designs. Competition is a good thing (lexus vs 7 series vs s class), outright copy as happens in china is shameful. this is a observation i hope others will see and agree and debate about instead of labeling me as anti chinese and delete my posts.
god_bless_japan said:well if critique/devils advocate helps China design better cars which the chinese can drive proudly anywhere in the world instead of being asamed of it then i will help as much as i can to put it another way China can keep Japan/germany from getting arrogant (overpriced$$) and threat/competion is a good thing for evry car buyer. China to take justified criticism and fixing thier plagerism is a good thing for the car buyers of the future.
i like the way u explain things, very clear and to the point, the above quote really explains some of the reasons why these enterprising compaines sprang up. So tell me this when the japanese, usa build cars in china, why was the price high for the chinese not to be able to afford them, was it chinese govt taxes or the foreigners were greedy??chinoy54 said:the analogy is, to a certain extent also true in the auto industry. for a very long time, 4-wheeled transport that wasn't commercial was limited to high-ranking officials & military officers. when china began opening up to western goods, guess who began producing cars in china-the usual suspects-GM, Ford, Toyota, et al. but the avreage chinese couldn't even dream of owning one of these products then, until enterprising companies like geely, chery, etc. began producing copies & selling them at a price w/ch the chinese could afford. the west gave the chinese the appetite for western goods, now the west blames them for
producing these goods at a lower price. we applaud the capitalistic urge to consume, yet we deride the products that feed the urge.
very true, but the Japanese also studied their european and US competition and discovered ****** in thier armour, like british cars had very bad after sales back up in USA. Japanese smanufacturers sorted this issues very quickly and took on Europe and Usa and won. The Datsun 240z single handledly dealt the MG, jaguar a death blow in the american market and america loves datsun 240Z. Subaru legacy/impreza copied Audi quattro/ lancia delta 4wd system and made a better car.RiseOfTheRev01ution said:I agree with Japan that it is bad that Chinese car makers copy, but lets not forgot how Toyota, Mitsubishi and many Japanese car makers started. They all were copied from European and American designs. No Japan is not like I_Hate_China (thank goodness) lol.
Japanese cars may look like dominating the US market but in Europe? NO, not even close!god_bless_japan said:very true, but the Japanese also studied their european and US competition and discovered ****** in thier armour, like british cars had very bad after sales back up in USA. Japanese smanufacturers sorted this issues very quickly and took on Europe and Usa and won. The Datsun 240z single handledly dealt the MG, jaguar a death blow in the american market and america loves datsun 240Z. Subaru legacy/impreza copied Audi quattro/ lancia delta 4wd system and made a better car.
I see no such unique ness with chinese manufactuers against their EU/US/japan competition. i would even argue that japan gives JV with chinese companies to keep China dependent on Japan(engines,chasis etc) and so that china do not develop/invest and become more independent/ self sufficient
Following Shanghai Auto's trillion dollar takeover of Toyota, GM suddenly swop in and took ownership of Shanghai and then asset stripped it to bail the Chinese out of insolvencychinoy54 said:... it will be the chinese, i think, who will have the last laugh when toyota will no longer be a japanese company because it was the subject of a hostile takeover from shanghai automotive. this could happen. look at rover, now part of nac.