[chabbu]

I just found out that a company called Global Holdings International is planning to bring the Nanjing Soyat line and an assortment of other Chinese cars, trucks, busses and heavy equipment (including a bizarre 3-wheeled dump truck) to Mexico and then the USA in 2007!
So if these people are presumably working with Nanjing on federalising the Soyat, might this mean that they will be the distributors for MG when the time comes?

 

[Windy]

I cant believe they want to import the current Soyat cars but it is interesting that that the announcement comes at the same time as the Spanish and UK MG dealerships announcments. Maybe the non-sporty cars based on the current MGs will be sold as new Soyats?

Will Nanjing beat the others to the USA?

 

[chabbu]

MG/Nanjing/Soyat viability

On the website for GH Motors Mexico, the only small car shown is the (current) Soyat, which they have model-named "INet". In the US press the company said that they will market everything from "minis" to heavy equipment. So the logical assumption is that they will try to US-federalise the Soyat. In the list of companies they plan to source from, I didn't see any other known builders of economy cars. The Soyat is one of the few Chinese small cars that already has airbags, so that helps a little.

 

[mgrovernut]

Nanjing have to take MG to the US. MG has a huge fan base over there. If Nanjing do decide to take MG to the US then everyone will soon say Cherry who? Seriously MG could be a big player in the USA.....

 

[chabbu]

Nanjing Soyat not USA-bound after all?

On the website for GH Motors Mexico, the only small car shown is the (current) Soyat, which they have model-named "INet". In the US press the company said that they will market everything from "minis" to heavy equipment. So the logical assumption is that they will try to US-federalise the Soyat. In the list of companies they plan to source from, I didn't see any other known builders of economy cars. The Soyat is one of the few Chinese small cars that already has airbags, so that helps a little.

After scrutinizing all of the websites I could find for the GH Motors group, I'm starting to think that the "minis" for the USA referred to by the Taiwanese CEO are actually minibusses and/or minivans, and that the Soyat may be intended for Mexico only.
Still, this means that the North American branch of the operation must be dealing with Nanjing on some level.
Chad

 

[E46DinanM3]

Nanjing have to take MG to the US. MG has a huge fan base over there. If Nanjing do decide to take MG to the US then everyone will soon say Cherry who? Seriously MG could be a big player in the USA.....

MG does not have a fan base at all over here. They went out of business here long before they did in Europe.

 

[Windy]

:nono:

Have you seen the length of the list of USA MG Clubs?

http://www.mgcars.org.uk/clubs/clubus.html

(don't try printing it - you will run out of paper! :lol: )

PS. Note - there are four entries in that list just for your home town of Portland Oregon!!!

 

[mgrovernut]

MG does not have a fan base at all over here..

]

If you check out the list of enthusiast clubs in the varoius states of America you will see just how much the brand is loved in the USA:

http://www.mgcars.org.uk/clubs/clubus.html

Furthermore the biggest single car club in the world is the MG owners club with over 50 000 members many of whom live in the US or the UK! So can I ask you to prove what you just said. Bet you can't, because that the most stupid thing I've heard anyone say on a forum like this ever!

 

[E46DinanM3]

Just drive around in America. You won't see many at all. They did not sell well at all here. Like I said, they didn't even sell enough to stay in business here.

Look at it this way, the biggest MG club has 50,000 people (not necessarliy all owners). Honda sells over 50,000 Accords in 2 months here. The fact is, MG made bad cars. Not even the British liked them enough to keep them in business.

Trust me on this one, I live in the states, I think I would know what Americans like and don't like better then someone who doesn't live here.

 

[Admin]

Even though the bottom line is that in the past MG Rovers failed in the US, it is a brand that defiantely has potential, and i think it is good news that it is being revived by the chinese. There are some companies that failed and werent revived because they had 0 potential, but the MG brand has still a following whether if it is small...and also the designs are quite appealing..

 

[mgrovernut]

Just drive around in America. You won't see many at all. They did not sell well at all here. Like I said, they didn't even sell enough to stay in business here.

Look at it this way, the biggest MG club has 50,000 people (not necessarliy all owners). Honda sells over 50,000 Accords in 2 months here. The fact is, MG made bad cars. Not even the British liked them enough to keep them in business.

Trust me on this one, I live in the states, I think I would know what Americans like and don't like better then someone who doesn't live here.

I've driven around the USA and I didn't see many Ferrari's, so presumably no one want's one then? I didn't see many Rolls Royce's or Bentley's either. So I presume these brands are worthless then! MG only left the US because Ralph Nader effectively killed the sportscar. It's the same reason that the E type Jag was removed from sale. No one remembers that car do they? (I'm being sarcastic just in case you have no idea what an E type is). You said Honda makes 50 000 Accords every 2 months in the US. So what? Lada makes 250 000 cars a year in Russia and has 2/3 rds of the market. How many Lada fan clubs do you know? The point is that in the USA no one has ever heard of Geeley, but car journalists know MG. So assuming the products are good then there will be a more natural bias towards them. If you have thousands of fans then that great marketing tool called word of mouth kicks in. It's not just about how many people know of MG, it's as much about what those people who knew the brand think of the cars.

P.S if MG is'nt well known how come Ross in Friends drove a bright red MG B in Friends?

 

[E46DinanM3]

Ferrari, Bentley, and Rolls are completely different. The fact is that you don't see them because you could afford over 10 mid-range MGs for the price of one Ferrari F430. They are too expensive for 99% of Americans, an MG isn't/wasn't.

I will admit that there is a small cult following for MGs, but its not the kind of consumer base you would want for a car to compete with Ford, Honda, Toyota, etc. The people that like MGs are similar to Lotus Elise or Mini Cooper fans. They can support a small-ish amount of sales, but its not what you want for a full sized lineup, which is what the Chinese companies should be going for.

Also, most MGs were horrendously unreliable. British car makers are known for how much time they spend in the shop.

 

[mgrovernut]

MG is thought of as a European brand and therefore if you combine low Chinese labour costs with European branding and styling then your likely to be on to a winner in any market. It's like asking Brits would you rather own a Pontiac or a Geeley? We haven't seen either brand here but we would rather have a car with an American brand than a Chinese one. Even if the Pontiac was nothing like a real Pontiac.

I suppose I look at it like this. The last time MG launched a sportscar it became the best selling sportscar in the UK, thrashing the Mx5 until it ceased production last year. When the car was launched MG Rover received thousands of enquiries from the US begging them to sell the car there. In fact MG had planned to go back to the US but BMW actually admitted to Rover bosses that they were worried it would steal sales off the Z3! Now tell me how many people have rang up Nanjing begging them for a Soyat? How many Americans have begged for a Geeley? The simple fact is that Nanjing will sell more cars in the US if they call the cars MG's. Think about it. If you are offered a car wearing a Nanjing badge on or an MG badge on what are you realistically going to want to tell your neighbours you just bought? A Nanjing or an MG?


By the way if British cars are a lot better nowadays (see: http://www.carpages.co.uk/jaguar/jaguar-jd-power-success-18-05-05.asp)

 

[mgrovernut]

I will admit that there is a small cult following for MGs, but its not the kind of consumer base you would want for a car to compete with Ford, Honda, Toyota, etc. The people that like MGs are similar to Lotus Elise or Mini Cooper fans. They can support a small-ish amount of sales, but its not what you want for a full sized lineup, which is what the Chinese companies should be going for.

Your dead right about the Mini Cooper. BMW really should have called the new MINI something else, after all they haven't sold many of those new MINI's have they (hint best selling Premium small car in the universe)

And why can't MG make a fuller line up of cars?

 

[E46DinanM3]

You completely missed my point. The Cooper is a great car, but you don't see BMW trying to sell a Mini sedan, a Mini sportscar, a Mini SUV, etc. Its a brand with the consumer base to sell one type of car, same thing with Lotus, and I think its the same way with MG. The old MG roadster was a cool car, (like the Cooper) but I don't think anyone is going to want something like an MG sedan. You can't build a full scale company off of a name like that. As far as I can tell, Chinese car companies want to build up to compete with the likes of Honda and Toyota, you don't do that by making a few very specialized niche cars, but making cars with broad appeal, like the Accord and the Camry.

Do you really think it will take long for consumers to figure out that MGs have become Chinese?

British cars are better, but still not competitive in reliability-

As you can see, Land Rover and Mini are next to last (thanks to Kia) and Jaguar isn't exactly stellar either.

 

[Windy]

but I don't think anyone is going to want something like an MG sedan.

Do you really think it will take long for consumers to figure out that MGs have become Chinese?

British cars are better, but still not competitive in reliability-

Err - I have an MG sedan - out of choice!

MG may now be owned by Nanjing but it has factories in both China and UK and is using mainly UK designers. To say it is now Chinese is not correct.

And as for reliability, I looked my MG up in reliability figures produced from warantee claims before purchase and it came out more reliable than any Honda sedan.

 

[mgrovernut]

You completely missed my point. The Cooper is a great car, but you don't see BMW trying to sell a Mini sedan, a Mini sportscar, a Mini SUV, etc. Its a brand with the consumer base to sell one type of car, same thing with Lotus, and I think its the same way with MG. The old MG roadster was a cool car, (like the Cooper) but I don't think anyone is going to want something like an MG sedan. You can't build a full scale company off of a name like that. As far as I can tell, Chinese car companies want to build up to compete with the likes of Honda and Toyota, you don't do that by making a few very specialized niche cars, but making cars with broad appeal, like the Accord and the Camry.

Do you really think it will take long for consumers to figure out that MGs have become Chinese?

But in a way the cars will be British as the engineering and styling is being done by Arup in the UK, all the Chinese will do is finance and assembly the cars. MG started life as a tuning house and first made sports saloons before becoming famed for its sportcars, so yes it can make cars like the Accord, as long as they retain a sporting flavour. Think of MG as building BMW style cars . My point is that whatever way you look at this using a Chinese brand is not as good as using the MG brand. It's really that simple. So ultimately MG will take on 'Honda and Toyota', but they will just be much more exciting cars....

 

[E46DinanM3]

We'll just have to agree to disagree. China still has not proven to be able to build vehicles that meet the quality of American, German, or Japanese cars. It is way to early to be saying that "ultimately MG will take on 'Honda and Toyota,'" because we havn't seen any signs that the Chinese can make a quality vehicle by our standards. I really think that most American consumers are smart enough to look behind a British badge to see what really goes into the car. They should take the approach that Honda, Toyota, and Nissan took when marketing their luxury cars abroad under Acura, Lexus, and Infiniti.

 

[E46DinanM3]

Read this- it focuses more on Rover then on MG, but many of the same ideas apply. Its written Jeremy Clarkson and he is pretty accurate on this one.

http://driving.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,12529-1580901_1,00.html

"I have little sympathy for anyone who ignored the advice of every expert in the land and bought a 45 'because it’s British'."

"When Volvo went all sporty, the weak and the feeble had to look elsewhere. Most ended up in Rovers, dithering at junctions and generally driving the wrong way down motorways. There's one Rover that has been stationary at the double mini-roundabout in Chipping Norton for 15 years, its driver paralysed with fear"

"Even so some people are saying the demise of MG Rover is my fault because I failed to give the cars a good review and sneered at the men in hats who drove them. I can’t understand this reasoning; am I supposed to recommend all cars that are made here irrespective of their price, performance or quality? Because if I am, all of you must go out tomorrow and buy a London cab."

 

[mgrovernut]

Of course Jeremy Clarkson loved the MG ZT 260. He called that charming. Bizare then that he hated the Rover 75 which won 18 major motoring awards when it was launched. I wonder how long we will have to wait for a chinese engineered and designed car to achieve that....